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Wikitravel:Destination of the Month candidates/Slush pile

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Contents

The following pages were proposed on Wikitravel:Destination of the Month candidates, but the consensus was generally against them. Beneath each proposed article are the objections that need to be addressed. Once this has been done, feel free to nominate them again.

2011[edit]

Kabul[edit]

Article status: guide (must be guide or above).
Time to feature: anytime
Nominated by: --AHeneen 01:39, 14 November 2009 (EST)
Comment: see blurb below

Mountains of Kabul.jpg

Somebody please write it! (more...)

I've given some love to this article by updating, formatting/cleaning up, and adding history. An interesting destination for the most seasoned of travelers, you could make a case for it as OtBP--few tourists (mostly military, businessmen, & redevelopment people), it's close to a war zone (and thus perceived as dangerous and off the beaten track), and it has a history of isolation & war (including much of the past 30 years)--but I have nominated it as DotM because despite its historical isolation it is a name recognized by most Westerners as Afghanistan's capital, number of visitors is high despite low number of tourists, it is rather safe despite its proximity to war zones to the south (towards Kandahar) & east (towards Jalalabad), and it is a large city and a regional center of culture and trade. The first 2 arguments for were brought up in discussions(Nov 08) over the nomination of Riyadh as a DotM.

The article is not perfect, as I struggled to find addresses or locations of some of the "see" listings I wonder whether much of Kabul has much of a street numbering system (even the US embassy does not list a number in describing there location). So one of two things needs to be done: some of you could help find out locations or we could just leave it as is and assume taxi drivers know where these places are and how to get there. A recent map would be nice along with more info to fill the "orientaion" section (or else it can be removed) and another thing I couldn't find was info for "Get in/By bus"...a simple note of where bus stations are is all that's needed. Aside from these couple of small problems, the article is a beauty and I'm going ahead with nominating it so it can get a decent spot in line to fill summer DotM slots. May-August seems like the appropriate window for Kabul. AHeneen 01:39, 14 November 2009 (EST)

  • Support A great article, except for a few things which need to be cleaned up as mentioned above. AHeneen 01:39, 14 November 2009 (EST)
  • Support. I'm rather amazed at the quality of this article! I agree that it should be featured as a DotM for the reasons you outline above. --Peter Talk 07:12, 14 November 2009 (EST)
  • Support This is a nice article for an interesting city. Some minor things that I'd add to be worked on: The Bagh-e Zanana is a place where only women can enter, right? It says "dedicated to women", which is awkward English, so if it means what I suspect it means, the wording should be changed (even if it doesn't, the wording could be clearer). The Bagh-e Bala should probably have some information about it (history, significance, the usual). Stadiums and cinemas are "Do"s, right? Also, "Money" probably shouldn't be its own heading. I'll make it a sub-heading of "Buy". ChubbyWimbus 15:46, 14 November 2009 (EST)
Yes, the park is women-only according to its Wikipedia article. I guess I overlooked a couple of things, feel free to add info...I'll see when I have time if I can fill in some more info. AHeneen 23:07, 14 November 2009 (EST) Okay, I've added some info for Bagh-e Bala and moved the stadium and cinema to the "Do" section. I also added content to the Bagh-e Zanana BUT most of the content came from this website:[1] The information is interesting, but I posted it in case someone wanted to challenge the info. I don't have any personal knowledge about the city, so if the article reeks of political agenda and seems false, feel free to get rid of the info and add a better description! ChubbyWimbus 01:20, 15 November 2009 (EST)
  • Support wow, nice work, i have also considered nominting Mogadishu for a while, since it's one of our most loved articles, if twitter is anything to go for, but I've no idea how to push it the last stretch. This one is already there, very good content. --Stefan (sertmann) talk 17:49, 14 November 2009 (EST)
If it is even possible to get it to guide status, given the difficulty of getting info about the city. How about Hargeisa, also in Somalia but DRASTICALLY safer, easier to visit, and very inviting to tourists. I read quite a bit about tourism in Kurdistan (Iraq) and looked through all its city articles, but only a couple (Dahuk & Arbil) were even at outline status and I knew I could not find enough info to bring them up to OtBP status. I would love to see some more articles from off-the-beaten-path countries. AHeneen 23:07, 14 November 2009 (EST)
  • Support Very good work. --Burmesedays 00:52, 19 November 2009 (EST)
  • Support This article is great and offers a DotM that most people would rule out as a travel destination. jan 03:27, 20 November 2009 (EST)
  • Maybe.... good work on the history section, that was much needed! However most of the listings in this article, especially the eat listings, were added years ago and I suspect are fairly outdated.... but I don´t know for sure. I worked on the few that I visited when I was there 3 years ago, but that wasn´t many. Also, for a destination such as this I think a good map is essential.... enough so that I would probably withold support until it has one. Re the question above about addresses, I don´t remember them being particularly relavent.... I don´t think taxi drivers use them much.... and I recall paying much more attention to intersections and dots on maps than addresses. Also about the bus stations.... I recall Kabul as fantastically complicated to get in and out of.... there are departure points scattered all over the place with minibuses headed to various locales.... tell a taxi driver where you want to go and he´ll take you to where the buses depart.... and probably get it wrong at least once – cacahuate talk 22:55, 19 December 2009 (EST)
Remarkably, OSM [2] has good coverage of Kabul! It shouldn't be hard at all to put up a basic import, but someone other than me will need to choose what part of the city needs to be covered in the map. Better to do that at Talk:Kabul. --Peter Talk 00:30, 20 December 2009 (EST) Still no map, I won't be able to do it, but can give a little feedback and guidance to anyone else who is willing on Talk:Kabulcacahuate talk 03:03, 26 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Object strongly. Does anyone else look at Kabul in the dotm blurb above and want to laugh? That on our front page is pretty much a joke. Still no map, in a city that I would say requires one more than any other destination we've ever featured. Many listings are almost certainly outdated. I also think that if it is improved and thus featured it should be OTBP (forgive me for not noticing and bringing that up earlier). – cacahuate talk 03:00, 1 June 2010 (EDT)
  • Support, but it should be an OtBP. --Tiagox2 09:33, 16 December 2010 (EST)
  • Oppose, it's a warzone. Besides, the information is probably outdated. --globe-trotter 19:16, 19 July 2011 (EDT)
I think "warzone" is a stretch when applied to Kabul. It's one of the safest cities, in an admittedly unsafe country, and is filled with foreigners. I'm working on a map that should knock a sock off or two, and will try to get the information refreshed in the coming weeks. --Peter Talk 21:35, 19 July 2011 (EDT) I know tourists go there, and Kabul is one of the safer areas of Afghanistan, but making it a DoTM? I still think it's an odd idea. Security issues can change overnight. We should be weary sending travelers to places like this, while at the same time warning them for life-threanening danger. --globe-trotter 22:41, 3 September 2011 (EDT)
  • Strongly object, I think the listing of things to see and do is not complete. Things to see: be witness of a suicide attack. Thinks to do: get abducted in broad daylight and have the experience of your life! Make Kabul Destination of the Month and Wikitravel will be Joke of the Year. --Whatsinaname 20:02, 20 July 2011 (EDT)
  • Don't support. We should not be encouraging tourism to an occupied country at war. At most, I'd suggest making it an OtBP. Ikan Kekek 02:44, 8 August 2011 (EDT)
  • Maybe OtBP, but definitely not DOTM now. Kabul is an interesting city, used to be a major stop on the overland route to India; the place itself would be fine as DOTM in other circumstances. The article itself looks close as well; Cacahuate's comments above have what seem to be valid objections, but those could be dealt with. However, it seems to me that recommending it as a destination now would be insane. It is certainly safer than some other places in Af, but not safe enough to recommend. Pashley 00:02, 9 September 2011 (EDT)

Kgalagadi Transfrontier Park[edit]

Again, I don't now if it should be an OtBP or a DotM, but seems like a nice article. --2.80.122.99 14:16, 25 January 2011 (EST)

  • Don't Support The "see" section could probably have more and certainly should have more to say about the museum and the "Do" section is mostly just a list. The "Sleep" section is not formatted correctly. ChubbyWimbus 01:02, 26 January 2011 (EST)
  • Don't Support - So many things wrong with it. Needs some serious formatting and detouting. I'm putting a style notice on it and downgrading it from guide. Probably should be slushed too. - Cardboardbird 22:26, 3 September 2011 (EDT)

Cologne[edit]

Very nice city article. --188.81.189.10 06:21, 14 August 2010 (EDT)

  • Needs work I removed it from the schedule because the articles needs work to fit our requirements. Maybe summer 2011 is better to allow the needed changes. jan 10:31, 24 January 2011 (EST)
  • Not yet I agree with Jc. Many restaurant and bar listings still lack addresses and telephone numbers. But once that's remedied, the rest of the article looks good. I think it's very close to being ready. Ikan Kekek 04:05, 8 August 2011 (EDT)

Salzburg[edit]

Nice guide of an austrian city. --2.80.109.50 12:35, 14 October 2010 (EDT)

Not yet It's on its way but some of the see listings are incomplete and the whole needs a thorough tidy up. - Cardboardbird 10:33, 31 May 2011 (EDT)
  • Not yet, needs quite some listingifying done before it's ready. --globe-trotter 11:50, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

Lyon[edit]

Nice guide article. --188.81.111.95 16:27, 21 October 2010 (EDT)

Not yet - The info is quite complete, writing is ok (could be tighter), but the formatting needs work. I'm confused why it is districtified but doesn't have separate district pages. The map doesn't entirely follow the WT style. The info box placements are inconsistent. The See text looks very dense. Cardboardbird 10:33, 31 May 2011 (EDT) Don't support - totally agree with Cardboardbird. Formatting needs a lot of work, and the whole districts subsection should be removed (as the city doesn't contain districts as of now). --globe-trotter 13:04, 31 May 2011 (EDT)

Dublin[edit]

Probably one of the nicest cities in the world where the people are so friendly. It's a great city for sight-seeing, shopping and if you want to get out of the hustle and bustle of city life, the beautiful Irish countryside is only a short drive away. I've never been in a city where the people are so friendly and you can experience a true Irish welcome there. The best time to visit is anytime really, though i would recommend the months of March - September where the weather is slightly better making your visit even more special.

  • Don't Support This article has a Style Tag that is rightfully there. It needs formatted listings outside the "See" section, and many sections need to be presented better and made less wordy. There are a lot of really long paragraphs that I think could be made more precise or reworded. ChubbyWimbus 22:46, 28 May 2011 (EDT)
  • Don't Support Not yet anyway. The style tags still remain and no progress on fixing yet. I'd say slush it till it at least the style issues are addressed. - Cardboardbird 21:46, 3 September 2011 (EDT)

Vercors[edit]

Surprisingly detailed article for the depths of France (or should it go to DotM instead?) --DenisYurkin 02:45, 26 July 2010 (EDT)

  • Not Yet There are a lot of listings, but they need to bee formatted properly. Right now it is more of a list of attractions with external links rather than an independent guide. ChubbyWimbus 03:10, 26 July 2010 (EDT)

Antigua Guatemala[edit]

Anne has put a bunch of work into this guide lately, and I think it looks pretty great. It's a world heritage site and Guatemala's top city destination, so I think it would be fine dotm material.

  • Support. --Peter Talk 19:55, 30 March 2009 (EDT)
Wow! This looks good! Is there a more appropriate place to put the "laundry" information aside from the Buy section? It really doesn't seem to belong there. 58.191.155.98 04:51, 1 April 2009 (EDT) It's normally a "Cope" topic, and I see that someone has moved it there. Support. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 14:19, 9 April 2009 (EDT)
  • Support And again, nice to see dotm/otbp ready guides, outside our "core" areas' of North America and Asia. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 08:45, 1 April 2009 (EDT)
  • Almost support. It is looking pretty good and has a ton of listings, but the see section is very weak, and should be one of the strongest. The article could also use a serious copyedit and a small beating with the MoS stick – cacahuate talk 17:52, 25 May 2009 (EDT)
Update: needs even more cleanup after today's verbose additions – cacahuate talk 21:27, 31 May 2009 (EDT) Yeah, a lot of work has been put into the article post-nomination, which has added good content, but has also mangled the English and some of the structural style. It shouldn't take that much work to get this back up to a DotM level of polish, but that work should be done before we feature it. --Peter Talk 01:02, 23 June 2009 (EDT) I tried to work on MoS items. I posted a thought about currency usage on the discussion page and changed most entries to local currency but left some in USD since some prices/locations seem to accept USD quite easily.Zepppep 13:34, 21 January 2010 (EST)
  • Support anew. I've restored this nomination from the slush pile, as I think Zepppep has resolved the outstanding issues, and this looks like it will be a good feature! --Peter Talk 15:44, 21 January 2010 (EST)
Hmm... The "See" section still isn't Wikified. It lists worthwhile places ("La Catedral, el Palacio de los Gobernadores, Convento de Capuchinas, Convento de Santa Clara, el Arco de Santa Catarina, Iglesia La Merced and the Handcrafts Market") but shouldn't they each then be given their own listing? They are kind of glazed over, but if someone were to visit using our guide, I imagine they would want that extra information. ChubbyWimbus 01:34, 22 January 2010 (EST)
  • Tentative support, as it is an interesting guide to a popular destination. But I would like to see some more work done on it. The first half looks a bit like an essay and would benefit from some sub-sections. A history sub-section is a glaring ommision from understand, when the destination is all about history. Most of the existing understand section could go into an orientation sub-section. Get in needs some categorisation. Perhaps split into "from the airport", "from Guatemala City" etc? I would support ChubbyWimbus' point about formalising attractions in the see section. Get out is very long and not really in line with the stated purpose of that section. All easy to put right I think. --Burmesedays 01:50, 22 January 2010 (EST)
  • Support --188.81.103.46 12:27, 21 May 2010 (EDT)
  • Slushed. This article has been in need of very obvious work for a long time and nothing has happened. Indeed it has deteriorated. --Burmesedays 22:20, 8 July 2011 (EDT)

Isha Yoga Centre[edit]

Really nice little article which I saw for the first time today. Well-written and seemingly complete. --Burmesedays 12:05, 10 August 2011 (EDT)

  • Not sure. While well-written, I am not sure if this even constitutes an article. The VFD discussion globe-trotter 00:10, 4 September 2011 (EDT)
  • The voting including keep recommendations from a number of regular Wikitravelers, as well as very obvious rigging. If it is a valid article, then it's of good enough quality to feature here. On the other hand, I was not around when that debate took place and the more I think about it, I might well have voted for delete...... hmmm. I would actually like to withdraw this nomination.--burmesedays 00:28, 4 September 2011 (EDT)
  • Slushed. Slushed by the nominator. I had a rush of blood. Not an appropriate feature article.--burmesedays 11:00, 4 September 2011 (EDT)

2010[edit]

Apple Valley (Minnesota)[edit]

A very complete article, although it has a strange sense of humor. --188.81.113.239 15:23, 18 August 2010 (EDT)

  • Not at this time. Most of the images in this article are under consideration for deletion on Shared, as User:Banana1 seems to have a tenuous grasp of copyright. LtPowers 15:42, 18 August 2010 (EDT)
  • Don't Support the Architecture section is not formatted properly, the prose need work in some places, and the pictures will be deleted. Also, it's definitely more of an OtBP. ChubbyWimbus 20:21, 18 August 2010 (EDT)

Khartoum[edit]

Another African find. This one in a much better shape than Niamey. It's extremely well written I think, it feels complete. There are some missing addresses here and there, but must of them has GPS coordinates instead, and this is Africa so I suspect there is a reason for those. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 11:17, 10 October 2009 (EDT)

  • Support, definitely. I find myself rather shocked that we have a great Sudanese article! And one that seems to have grown organically, without love from any one contributor. --Peter Talk 14:20, 10 October 2009 (EDT)
  • Nice, but needs work A surprisingly good article for the region, but I think it needs more information before it is fit for DotM...this is a city of EIGHT million! As for coordinates, they are very useful to some people, not at all to others. I've been doing a bit of browsing the past few months on the [4] and coordinates are used (& more useful than addresses) by practically everyone driving themselves...but for other tourists (and there are lots doing Cairo-Nairobi independently or with an overland bus) addresses are more helpful (even just the street name, esp. for telling the taxi driver and watching for signs on a minibus).
    • Photos: There is one good picture and one that isn't really necessary.
    • Intro: Needs some history and certainly needs some climate info
    • Get in: (By bus) Where's the new bus terminal/name? (By train) So the station is chaotic and trains erratic, but how do I get a ticket?
    • See: Could use some more items and lengthier descriptions.
    • Do: Two things?
    • Buy: Lists places, but are there any particular items which are good to buy?
    • Eat: I realize this is Africa and so there are thousands of small, good places to eat which frequently open/close and relocate...so we don't really need more listings. But this section would be best served by dividing it into the three sections of the city.
    • Drink: Why does 'drink'='alcohol'. Is tea served anywhere?
    • Cope: A few more embassy listings.
    • Get out: Descriptions should be more brief and those destinations should have their own article. I think the Red Sea area and Jebel Barkal listings are too far away (and in whole other regions of Sudan) to be listed.
    • Stay Safe: A VERY important section is missing! While the city is considered one of the safest for expats in E.Africa (despite violence elsewhere in the country), there are quite a few cultural sensitivities. If you follow the news, you'd know that in Khartoum: a schoolteacher was imprisoned for naming a teddybear Muhammed, a Sudanese journalist was jailed and sentenced to a fine & 40 lashes for wearing trousers (deemed inappropriate attire for a woman), and a US embassy employee and his driver were shot to death last year by conservative Islamists (although terrorism isn't really a huge threat). Political topics should be avoided. Some are sensitive to the North-South conflict (I think the South will vote on independence in a year or two), the Darfur conflict (I doubt many will side with Westerners who blame the Sudanese gov't), and the warrant for Bashir's arrest issued earlier this year (which Western governments lauded).
So, while the article is much better than most African ones, I think a lot of info should be added to bring it to true guide status and to be featured. The second edition Bradt guide (the best guides to African countries) for Sudan should be released this December, [5]. The first edition is a bit outdated, and this one claims a big update to Khartoum info. I got the Bradt guides to Mali, Niger, & Nigeria this summer and they are truly incredible in their scope of these 'off-the-beaten-path' destinations...if someone picks up this guide, I guarantee we could have a star article for Khartoum. Another good source of info is over at LP Thorntree [6]. I'd do most of the updating myself, but I'm very busy (and it's quite late at night while I'm writing this)...hopefully I'll find time to contribute to this fine destination soon. AHeneen 02:57, 13 October 2009 (EDT) The Stay safe argument is quite compelling, so should we slush this? --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 17:31, 14 October 2009 (EDT) NO. As far as safety goes, visitors must simply be careful to avoid insulting Islam (I think it's about the same as in Saudi Arabia or Iran) and avoiding politics concerning the North-South conflict and the president's role in the Darfur conflict (just like you shouldn't discuss politics in many countries). Khartoum seems to me like an interesting city in the region, and with just a little work (like I outlined) it could be a great DotM. AHeneen 23:13, 14 October 2009 (EDT) I can't find much info to fix this article. I really hope it stays here and isn't slushed for a while as I would really like to see it featured. As far as timing goes, very important and (we hope not) potentially explosive elections are set to run from 5-12 April with results announced later in the month. While the city is not too dangerous to be rejected for DotM, these are the first elections since 1986 and the first after decades of civil war. As the capital and largest city of the country combined with very sensitive elections, I think it should not be featured earlier than June...to give time to see if violence (like in Iran) breaks out. Again, it is otherwise a fairly safe city. AHeneen 17:56, 13 December 2009 (EST) Actually, I think featuring it during the elections period might be best, since people will be googling "Khartoum!" We are featuring Copenhagen during the COP15 summit, which clearly is not a great time to visit, but to great effect. The true goal of the DotM is really just to attract new users (aside from encouraging users to improve their pet projects with the reward of a front page feature, of course). Stefan noted that on 14 Dec, "Copenhagen" was the #3 "hot search" on Google trends, and our guide was the #3 search result! I think featuring articles when they are in the news can be a good way to give our site extra exposure. --Peter Talk 23:57, 17 December 2009 (EST) Aw, I like to think there's a wider variety of goals in featuring destinations! ;-) ChubbyWimbus 00:22, 18 December 2009 (EST)
  • I would like to echo AHeneen's sentiments. I would definitely love to see this featured, but I'm also curious as to whether Khartoum should be the DotM. This city shouts OtBP me. Am I mistaken? -- Sapphire • (Talk) • 20:50, 28 October 2010 (EDT)
At this point, the nomination is over a year old with no move to make it good enough to be featured. I support it as a DotM nomination over OtBP, but I think this current nomination is at a stalemate... Should we slush it? ChubbyWimbus 03:42, 5 November 2010 (EDT) Good eye - I just saw "October." I guess, as no one has really addressed her points, yes, it should be slushed. -- Sapphire • (Talk) • 12:55, 10 November 2010 (EST)

Vienna[edit]

Great city guide of one of the world's biggest tourist destinations. --2.80.109.50 12:35, 14 October 2010 (EDT)

There is a Hofburg Palace and a New Hofburg Palace, right? They are right next to one another, right? Why are they in different sections of the guide? This is a great example of why districts need to be used instead of the arbitrary headlines "Palaces, Museums, Architecture, etc." It feels highly disorganized. ChubbyWimbus 18:53, 14 October 2010 (EDT)
  • Don't support Article is far away from being DotM! It lacks maps, some district structure and Get in is still way to big. jan 04:05, 19 November 2010 (EST)
  • Don't support. It really requires districts as now it's too much information on one page. --globe-trotter 11:40, 19 November 2010 (EST)

Kiev[edit]

This article is an excellant, very comprehensive guide to an amazing city. —The 80.47.236.121 (talk • contribs)

  • Almost support. It's actually fairly close, to my pleasant surprise! But there are a few issues holding it back from quite reaching guide status, including the lack of buy listings. If you are interested in fixing the article up a bit, please let me know and I'll provide a bit more guidance on the article's talk page! It would be great to feature such a beautiful, important, and fascinating city, so I hope we can in the near future. --Peter Talk 20:23, 6 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Not yet. The whole article is nice and comprehensive, but the See section is very messy and clearly incomplete. Several important sights, such as the House with Chimeras, are just missing. And Hreschatik is more than "the main drag of the city centre".
By the way, this brings another question. Kiev is a large and a rich city. Should it be districtified? If yes, this will probably delay the nomination for quite a while... Atsirlin 16:09, 28 April 2010 (EDT) Ultimately, yes, it most certainly should have districts. I think it's OK, though, to feature before they are implemented, as long as the article is a strong guide—and it's not quite there yet. —The preceding comment was added by Peterfitzgerald (talkcontribs) One more thing that came to my mind: what about the season? I think, this should be spring, the blossoming period. If so, one can interrupt the discussion for half a year and see what comes out till then. Atsirlin 12:03, 30 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Nearly. Peter has identified the key omission. Otherwise, a bit of a spring clean and this would make an excellent DotM I think.--Burmesedays 22:01, 28 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Don't Support Basedi on the districtification comments, if we anticipate Kiev having so much to see/do that it needs districts, then this article must be highly incomplete, because it is nowhere near ready for districtification. If the city really has that much left out, then I would rather not feature it until it has its districts. ChubbyWimbus 09:35, 30 April 2010 (EDT)
Well, don't take my comment too serious. The present version is reasonably close to a "one day in Kiev" guide that obviously does not need any districts. However, this will not be a full guide to Kiev. Atsirlin 12:03, 30 April 2010 (EDT)

Adelaide[edit]

Although Australia is a very turistical country, Adelaide is not one of the country's biggest attractions. The article is very complete --85.243.150.10 13:44, 26 April 2010 (EDT)

Adelaide is by no stretch of the imagination Off the beaten Path. Any nomination should be as Destination of the Month. Maybe you meant to put it there?--Burmesedays 22:30, 26 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Not Yet I think proper formatting would be good for this article, but even beyond that, the "See" section needs reworked. If the linked (and redlinked) areas are cities outside of Adelaide, then they should be in the "Get out" section. If they are in Adelaide city, they should be put in proper format and more information needs to be provided. Many of the entries are just names of museums. If you know the city, it probably wouldn't take much to get it up to standard, but I think there is still work to be done. ChubbyWimbus 22:52, 26 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Not yet and is also not OtbP. Adelaide is a charming city and one I have enjoyed visiting a couple of times. I am not sure his article captures that charm very well. The Understand, See and Do sections need a fair bit of work I think.

London[edit]

A great city with a good guide article. --188.81.105.156 03:48, 5 July 2010 (EDT)

It certainly meets the requirements as it is, but I would personally like to wait until it's of an even higher quality. We featured Bangkok a long time ago, before all the recent work transformed it into a glittering work of art, and it's disappointing that we cannot feature it again. I'd hate to run into the same problem with London, if at a later date we have a contributor putting tons of work into it. --Peter Talk 19:57, 5 July 2010 (EDT)
  • Not Yet Some of the other boroughs are rather weak "usables". I also wonder if the page should be organized like New York City? With nearly 30 sub-categories, it just seems a bit overwhelming putting it all on the country article. ChubbyWimbus 17:31, 8 July 2010 (EDT)
  • Not yet, for the same reasons as Peter. --globe-trotter 08:24, 9 July 2010 (EDT)

Cologne[edit]

Beautiful city and a decent guide article. --2.80.96.196 07:31, 15 July 2010 (EDT)

Seville[edit]

Good article, great city. --188.81.103.46 12:41, 21 May 2010 (EDT)

  • Not Yet This article needs more pictures. The article suffers greatly from a lack of proper formatting. There is also information in the See and Do sections that should be in the Get around section. ChubbyWimbus 21:53, 10 June 2010 (EDT)

Bilbao[edit]

A guide article --188.81.103.46 12:41, 21 May 2010 (EDT)

  • Not Yet The Buy, Drink, Eat, and Sleep sections need more listings and more information about the current listings. Even some of the listings in the See section could use more information. Proper formatting would be nice. ChubbyWimbus 21:48, 10 June 2010 (EDT)

Grand Canyon[edit]

A huge touristic attratction, and a guide article --188.81.103.46 12:41, 21 May 2010 (EDT)

  • This article has been slushpiled however, User:Wrh2 has added content to the previously incomplete trail description. I do not know if all the trails are covered or if enough has been said about them to judge whether or not this concern is still relevent, but I think it's always good to review the slushpile. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by ChubbyWimbus (talkcontribs)

Florence[edit]

A pretty good article. --81.193.162.197 11:37, 8 May 2010 (EDT)

Don't Support (Yet). Good article and seems pretty comprehensive however Understand seems way too long and a lot of the listings need some MOS work. Tarr3n 05:14, 12 May 2010 (EDT)

Dogon Country[edit]

Just got back from a trip there and even after traveling a lot, was still impressed. Put a great deal of what I saw and learned in to heavily expanding the article. I think that in six months more can probably be added to make it worthy of a feature. Or maybe it's an OTBP instead? Not sure. Whatever the case, if it doesn't make it in to the rotation, my feelings will certainly not be hurt, although it is a very, very cool place. --Primecoordinator 10:54, 05 April 2010 (UTC)

This should be at the bottom of the list, not top - moved. I would have thought a cast iron OtbP, rather than DotM.--Burmesedays 10:12, 5 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Almost support. I would love to see Dogon Country featured, especially since that article was frustratingly not even created until last December, languishing as a red link on my wishlist! The one obstacle is the empty Bandiagara article. If we could improve that article to a strong usable, then this would be a great feature. And I definitely agree that this should be OtBP—while very well known in Africa travel circles, it's still pretty far out of the way. --Peter Talk 11:35, 5 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Support Sorry, didn't realize and still don't really understand how the order of this page is to work. Figured if I stuck it at the top, someone would put it somewhere better ;) So, then it should be an OtbP instead. makes sense. There are a lot of question marks up top, so I'll leave it to whomever to either move it to an earlier month of just move it across to October. And I have expanded Bandiagara out a good deal. Still slim, but a lot more there now. Maybe someone else can find a few more items. It's a small town, so it's bound to remain pretty small. --Primecoordinator 22:57, 05 April 2010 (UTC)
Is there anything that can be said about each of the villages aside from whether or not they have housing? The "See" section should probably say more. If descriptions of the villages were added, perhaps they could even be moved to the "See" section? I personally always think it's strange if the "See" section is lacking information. It makes it seem like the area is boring, but clearly this is a major destination in West Africa and well worth the visit. I am not sure if Dogon County is OtBP... I know I've said this before, but I don't like always making Africa OtBP. It's a well-known destination for those familiar with Africa; and more famous worldwide than Hamamatsu, I would say. I think it is a nice DotM. ChubbyWimbus 01:18, 6 April 2010 (EDT) I agree, Dogon Country should certainly be a DotM as it is one of the most popular attractions in West Africa. AHeneen 03:51, 6 April 2010 (EDT) Well, I just moved it, although it can definitely be moved back. I think that the issue of it being in Africa would apply more if it were Bamako, Abidjan, Nairobi, Dakar, etc. Those are DotM and it's true that as Dogon is 12-14 hours by bus from Bamako it takes some effort to get to. I'll work on the Abidjan article and see if I can get it in to shape to be a DotM as it's quite a happening city with direct service from major airports, whereas Dogon has none. --Primecoordinator 16:38, 06 April 2010 (UTC)
  • Don't support (yet) I would like to see this featured, but the article still needs a lot more information. Featured articles should be at guide status and while length is no indicator of an article's quality, I feel Dogon Country still needs much more information. According to the Wikitravel:Region guide status, a guide region "gives you different choices for which linked destinations (i.e., cities, subregions, and other destinations lists) to visit (all usable status or better), and information on multiple attractions and things to do...All important ways to get in are detailed, along with some suggestions for moving out, and thorough information on getting around." Since culture is what attracts so many to Dogon Country (although there's really no "stereotypical" Dogon culture), I think the understand section should contain an overview of the cultural facets which make DC so appealing to visitors (masks, gender roles, animism, etc) along with some history & info on the architecture. The see/do sections need to be expanded and I feel information about hiking and finding a guide and starting needs to be together. The "guide to guides" can be condensed a little and should go under "Get around" along with other info on hiking (ie. where to start info now listed under get in). Finally, a mention of the Festival des Danses des Masques is essential along with info about it. I have a (slightly outdated...2005) Bradt Guide to Mali which has much of this information...I just need to not be lazy one evening and fill in some of this missing info (there's 3 pages about Bandiagara). Until then, the official DC tourism website is here and has some useful info. The best time to visit (and thus feature DC) is between November & February (cool and dry), which is perfect as it's winter in the Northern Hemisphere and we usually have a lack of good choices for DotM/OtBP then and it gives us time to get DC to guide status. AHeneen 03:51, 6 April 2010 (EDT)
Sounds like you've had a lot of experience there. I don't really have too much more to add to the article as I poured out everything I had gotten from my trip. I hope you find some time to add all this in. And I think that October would be the perfect month as most people need info in the month before the trip,so if November if the start of the busy season, October makes sense to run it then. --Primecoordinator 16:43, 06 April 2010 (UTC) It surely has to be OtbP? How many visitors who are not fairly grizzled travelers go to Dogon country? Or have even heard of it? In 2005 (latest I could find) there were only 80,000 foreign arrivals to the whole of Mali. I would imagine a large number of those were business, government and NGO travelers. Of the balance, some would have gone to Dogon country. If this isn't OtbP, I am not sure what is. --Burmesedays 05:01, 6 April 2010 (EDT) Saw a lot of poshy, older package folks when I was there. A lot of it is just off the road or down a slightly bumpy dirt road, which is easy to get to if you can stand the heat. Then there are the 12km hikes down the cliff that I did which are more for those with an adventurous spirit... Still, I think OtbP probably makes more sense. --Primecoordinator 16:46, 06 April 2010 (UTC) I think it's more famous than many of our DotMs: I mentioned Hamamatsu, but Shimla, Bergen, Medellin, Okayama, Bayreuth; Not exactly world-reknown destinations, either. Maybe I am atypical, but Dogon County seems much more famous than any of those. Tourism statistics can only do so much, anyway, because Africa will almost always lose if we are comparing it to Europe or America, who have the money to travel. Timbuktu is in Mali, and it's name is very famous, thanks to that quote. I'd call that DotM, but the statistics argument could be made against it, as well. Bandiagara is one of Africa's best known World Heritage Sites. It made our "Top Nine Other destinations" on the Continental page. If our top nine can't even be DotM, then I don't know what would qualify... ChubbyWimbus I'm pretty sure Timbuktu is a byword/cliche for remote? Among people who think a lot about West African tourism, Dogon Country is a popular wishlist destination, at least, but it's pretty far off any path that even reasonably approaches a beaten look. That's one of the reasons why I'd love to visit. This place could get ruined quickly by serious tourism. I'd say the only destination in Mali that could plausibly be DotM would be Bamako, as that is a big, bustling city. If you look through our previous OtBPs you'll see plenty that are much better known and far more visited, like Mesa Verde, Panmunjeom, Denali, or, hell, even Dalian. There's always room for debate at the margins, but I'm a little surprised that this one is drawing any. --Peter Talk 20:13, 6 April 2010 (EDT) I think that there is also a secondary issue in that people aren't too keen to support it if the article isn't near Star quality, which, unless someone steps up to bat, it will probably stay. By the way, is there a tag to put on an article that's up for DotM or OtbP? Might get more people to work on it if there's the chance it could be featured. Otherwise, it seems like the same 10 or so people working on most of the articles. --Primecoordinator 22:09, 06 April 2010 (UTC) Nah, star quality is definitely not needed, especially for a OtBP. It just needs to be squarely at guide status, and that's a little shaky at present. Shouldn't be too hard to fix, especially as there are a bunch of people interested in it. --Peter Talk 20:13, 6 April 2010 (EDT) You would really place Bamako above Dogon Country? I see your point that it's not exactly the type of place you can hop on a bus and go in 10 minutes, but I think it's fame extends far beyond Mali's borders. As you said, those who know West Africa know Dogon Country (and often want to go there), and I'd still venture to say those who know Africa as a whole know Dogon Country/Bandiagara. Hamamatsu isn't even that popular among those interested in Japan, and I doubt most people interested in the broader East Asia have heard of it. Medellin doesn't bring anything to my mind, and neither does Bergen (I don't think the nation itself is known for much more than fjords outside of Europe) yet somehow a destination that is actually known is being questioned simply because it's African? I don't see why we have such loose rules on what can be DotM in Europe/Japan, yet we take such a hard-line approach with Africa. Africa isn't Europe, and it shouldn't have to be. It's major attractions may not be engulfed by cities, but since when was that a requirement for DotM? I was/am surprised that there is opposition to this as DotM; It seemed like a clear-cut example of an African DotM to me. ChubbyWimbus 22:37, 6 April 2010 (EDT) Absolutely, this isn't just about fame (and I don't really think Dogon Country is so famous—I'd wager that if you asked every last English speaker, <1% would know what it was, and I'm absolutely including your average world traveler). The paths leading to Dogon are not beaten—it's a tiny place quite purposefully in the middle of nowhere in a country with very few tourists. I know there's a bit of sensitivity to the fact that African destinations are more likely to be listed as OtBPs than destinations in other continents, but a) I don't see how that can apply for this one, when it is similar to our Mesa Verde OtBP (a popular American cliffside village), and b) Africa simply is a less-visited continent. (And to me, this is a plus.) --Peter Talk 22:56, 6 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Should this be slushed? More content is needed, but nothing has been added for over a month. ChubbyWimbus 00:05, 19 May 2010 (EDT)

Space[edit]

Why not, after all? A valid guide-level article, and absolutely not only for April 1. --DenisYurkin 15:58, 27 April 2010 (EDT)

Before proceeding with support/opposition, this was nominated in 2007 and received the critique that many of the listed opperators do not actually allow civilians to go to space [7]. If this remains true, then perhaps it is still not ready for nomination. Does anyone know? ChubbyWimbus 16:13, 27 April 2010 (EDT) Irrelevant -- "Any destination, region, itinerary or event that passes the "What is an article?" test is eligible for DotM/OtBP." Of course, if there are inaccuracies re: operators, they should be fixed. My personal opinion, though, is that we should hold off on Space until Virgin Galactic starts flying in a year or two and the destination becomes slightly more approachable. $100k ain't cheap, but it's not utterly within the realm of fantasy in the way that a $20m trip is... Jpatokal 19:11, 27 April 2010 (EDT) Judging from your response, I'd say that discussion is just as relevant now as it was then. You are concerned that we are featuring a destination that people can't realistically visit, which is basically what is expressed in the discussion, and your own response could be refuted with the information you've cited. ChubbyWimbus 19:29, 27 April 2010 (EDT) Not exactly. Jani was just saying that there is a better time to feature this article: when Virgin Galactic "launches." It's best to feature articles when there is buzz about them, when they are in the news. → more hits for our site. We have already featured destinations not everyone can get to, like Wake Island (which was a great feature, IMO). --Peter Talk 22:00, 27 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Strongly oppose. Perhaps the 2.5 hour trip will become as "cheap" as US$ 100,000 (currently reckoned to be more like US$ 200,000 I think), all of which goes on burning more fuel than a decent sized town manages in a day. I cannot think of a more self-indulgent, destructive and pointless travel idea; nobody should be recommending this.--Burmesedays 22:28, 27 April 2010 (EDT)
Although I can't disagree with any of your points, we can't bar features for moral reasons, and that would be a slippery slope. Places like Amsterdam, Bangkok, or Las Vegas could easily be described as "self-indulgent, destructive" destinations. ChubbyWimbus 03:36, 28 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Oppose until Virgin actually starts to fly most public available offers are either limited to abundance of money or scientific staff. French Novespace [8] is one of the few who regularly does it for official space agencies and invited guest. Let's wait a couple of years. jan 04:15, 28 April 2010 (EDT)
Just a reminder, neither disdain for a destination/topic nor scheduling matters are grounds for an actual oppose vote per the #Select guidelines. I'm all for slushing this, though, and bringing it back during a more opportune news cycle, per Jani's suggestion. --Peter Talk 01:05, 29 April 2010 (EDT) Of course it doesn't count, but the opinion remains :) --Burmesedays 01:28, 29 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Don't Support I do think that when the timing is years off, there are grounds for not supporting a nomination (having nominations that we can't actually feature cluttering up the page only give a false sense of options to feature). Beyond that, though, I think some of the links to Earth sites really need to be improved. I mean, this is pretty much an OtBP that we would feature just because it's "interesting" and "cool" rather than a realistic destination. Also, I think more could be said about preparations, what you can/will see and do, etc. This was written by people who have never actually been to space, is it not? Sections are rather sparse, and I think there is expertise needed to make this a real guide and possible feature that we just don't have. I would honestly only call this a "usable" guide. ChubbyWimbus 03:03, 29 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Support It's a good article. Why not? --81.193.160.225 17:09, 5 May 2010 (EDT)

Baku[edit]

A good guide article. --81.193.160.225 15:44, 6 May 2010 (EDT)

  • Not quite. The buy section is very weak, and both the bars and restaurants really need descriptions, but the most important omission is information about the Old City! That should be a good, long section of "See," as it is the city's main attraction, and simply because there is so much to be said! --Peter Talk 21:01, 6 May 2010 (EDT)

World Heritage Tour in Nara[edit]

A good article, although it only has one image.--2.80.122.145 15:03, 15 May 2010 (EDT)

  • Don't Support As I metnioned on the Talk Page, I don't believe the Asuka-Yoshino-Ominesan part is feasible in a day. Nara city was also featured as recently as this January, so this would seem like a double-feature. ChubbyWimbus 02:31, 16 May 2010 (EDT)

Quebec City[edit]

Great article. --2.80.122.145 15:08, 15 May 2010 (EDT)

  • Don't Support It's a rather weak guide article. Most listings are just one-liners and a website. Like many of the recent nominations, this article would be well on its way to being a real candidate by properly formatting it and filling in the missing information. ChubbyWimbus 04:54, 16 May 2010 (EDT)

Istanbul[edit]

Great city. I'm surprised it hasn't been featured yet. --2.80.122.145 14:55, 16 May 2010 (EDT)

Actually in surprisingly good shape, with all districts at usable and a rather good lead article, but there are still enough empty sections here and there, that I'd mostly prefer it be used for backup. --Stefan (sertmann) talk 17:20, 16 May 2010 (EDT)
  • Not Yet The main criticisms are addressed in the CotM nomination, along with the need for more even coverage across all districts, as Sertmann mentioned. ChubbyWimbus 02:01, 17 May 2010 (EDT)

Bangkok[edit]

A nice article. --81.193.162.197 11:57, 8 May 2010 (EDT)

  • Strong support. Largely due to Globe-trotter's enormous recent work on these articles, Bangkok has become one of our best huge city guides. Great feature. --Peter Talk 12:02, 8 May 2010 (EDT)
  • Don't Support This article was already featured in January 2005, and our guidelines state, "The nominated article must not have been featured previously." ChubbyWimbus 16:37, 8 May 2010 (EDT)
Bangkok is ineligible for the reason ChubbyWimbus describes, although perhaps the strongest district article could be featured instead? At a glance, I'd say that's Rattanakosin, but Thonburi is also good. Gorilla Jones 17:15, 8 May 2010 (EDT) Indeed. It seems a shame to disqualify it, since the article bears little resemblance to the short page featured five years ago [9]. The Rattanakosin article is excellent, but I have mixed feelings about featuring a district of a city that has already been featured, unless it has a character sufficiently distinct from what people think of when they think of the city—I think it would work best to choose an "OtBP district" with a good dose of individual character. Previously suggested Chicago/Bronzeville as well as Copenhagen/Christiania would be good examples of what I mean. For Bangkok, I would say this would be Yaowarat and Pahurat, which is ready save the eat and drink sections. --Peter Talk 09:01, 9 May 2010 (EDT) Too bad it cannot be qualified anymore, as the Bangkok article has improved considerably. Now might not be the best time to feature it though (although it is in the news a lot). If we're looking for a neighborhood that is considerably different or off-the-beaten-path I'd say Yaowarat and Thonburi could qualify. But I'd need some time to improve them even more. --globe-trotter 09:22, 17 May 2010 (EDT) It definitely is a shame. That's the problem with featuring articles prematurely, which is why I won't support Kiev right now. Eventually we will have to re-feature articles, but there is still so much of the world that has not been featured, I can't see that happening anytime soon. To keep this page organized, should we slush Bangkok and then nominate the chosen district whenever it is deemed ready? ChubbyWimbus 12:41, 17 May 2010 (EDT)

Kunming[edit]

A good article on one of China's nicer cities, a provincial capital with some historical importance.

I live in China; to me this seems a major destination, DotM candidate. I wonder, though, if others might think it is more an "Off the beaten path" candidate. Among WT itineraries, Kunming is the jumping off point for Yunnan tourist trail (definitely well beaten), one end point for Overland Kunming to Hong Kong, and on some of the routes in Overland to Tibet and Long March.

  • Almost Support. The Do section is empty and the Eat section needs to be cleaned up, with some restaurants and preferably food pictures added, but other than that it's looking pretty good. I'd pop for DotM, it's a fairly major destination. Jpatokal 08:13, 3 September 2009 (EDT)
  • Not Yet It's a great destination, and is definitely more of a DotM, but I don't think it's ready yet. I think the "Understand" section could be more clear. Some of the entries/sections are not properly formatted. The organization of the "See" section would also be better if it were organized according to locale rather than arbitrary things like "Buildings" and "museums". The two temples could be presented better, also. Pictures are needed, as JPatokal pointed out. The "Do" section definitely needs content. No featured destination should have empty sections. ChubbyWimbus 20:59, 5 September 2009 (EDT)

Can an itinerary be DotM? Yunnan tourist trail covers four towns, three at guide & one a good outline, and two trekking areas, one guide & one stub. Could the whole thing be DotM? Pashley 21:29, 16 October 2009 (EDT)

Yes, the Dalton Highway was an OtBP, but...I believe it's the article which must have DotM-worthy content, and Yunnan tourist trail certainly does not contain DotM-worthy content. AHeneen 00:21, 19 November 2009 (EST)

Christchurch[edit]

Another find outside our core areas, this time found among our most edited destinations. We might have the (usual) issues with formatting again, but the content definitively seems up to standards. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 08:21, 14 October 2009 (EDT)

  • Almost support. I like the article and the city, and I'm not a stickler for formatting, but there are a handful of junk listings that would need to be cleaned out, and I'd like to see a bit more organization within the headings to emphasize highlights — as it is, they're all just long lists of listings. Gorilla Jones 23:00, 15 October 2009 (EDT)
  • Support. Great destination (when it is not foggy and raining... errr.... ). The article looks a wee bit untidy at first glance but nothing that a quick spring clean would not put right. And it needs a climate section as the weather is an extremely important factor down there. --Burmesedays 23:10, 15 October 2009 (EDT)
  • Soft support The sleep section is weak with non standard listings (budget/mid-range/splurge), the article does not have a map and some minor formatting issues that can be handled until the article goes online. jan 09:13, 16 October 2009 (EDT) Withdrawn support no improvement and does not match our criteria. Shall it end in the slush pile ? jan 05:33, 1 February 2010 (EST)
    • With only eight listings, the budget/mid-range/splurge headers are not needed. =) LtPowers 09:41, 16 October 2009 (EDT)
    • The drink and sleep section are not up to our standards and we don't have a map for the city. I think the article is a bit weak for DotM if not someone rather soon starts to improve the article. Maybe we take the article out of the schedule until someone starts to work on the open issues. jan 11:58, 25 November 2009 (EST)
  • Needs work With only 8 listings, the Sleep section is woefully inadequate for a city the size of Christchurch. One sleep listing is probably better in a separate Lincoln article rather than Christchurch, while the other 7 are a rather incomplete selection of mostly downtown accommodation. There are many (hundreds, perhaps even a thousand) more places to sleep in Christchurch than those listed, both in the city and the suburbs. Enought to justify budget/mid-range/splurge headings with 10 or more places listed in each. Many of the other listings lack addresses or other contact details. Also, there is no mention of Canterbury University or other places of learning. - Huttite 05:49, 19 October 2009 (EDT)
  • Should this be slushpiled? I am not sure of the criteria for that.....--Burmesedays 03:34, 29 April 2010 (EDT)

Durham (England)[edit]

A pretty popular destination, and a good article --81.193.160.225 17:06, 5 May 2010 (EDT)

  • Don't Support The "See" section needs to be written with the proper format. Currently, it is not much more than a redirect to other websites. Other sections (such as "Eat") are also suffering from lack of information and formatting. If you're up to the task of improving it, have a look at the Wikitravel:Manual of style to see exactly how listings should look. You may also want to have a look at the Previous Destinations of the month for examples of articles that have been featured.ChubbyWimbus 17:29, 5 May 2010 (EDT)
  • Don't Support. A badly formatted article which is very incomplete and does no justice to a really interesting city.--Burmesedays 02:50, 7 May 2010 (EDT)
  • Don't Support. For the reasons given above, and also becasue it's so close to Newcastle-upon-Tyne which looks like it will be featured shortly. Hopefully this nomination will spur a few people to work on it though. It's a great destination so if we can get the guide up to scratch perhaps it could feature in a year or two. Tarr3n 05:05, 12 May 2010 (EDT)

Barcelona[edit]

A huge touristic destination, and a very complete article as well. --85.243.150.10 14:19, 27 April 2010 (EDT)

  • Don't Support The lack of consensus on how to districtify this article is a problem. Also, it has been nominated as a Collaboration of the Month [10]. These concerns need to be addressed before Barcelona can be considered.ChubbyWimbus 00:05, 29 April 2010 (EDT)
  • Don't Support I absolutely love Barcelona as it is my second (and soon to be first) home but the fact of the matter is that this article is a mess. I have no idea how it got so out of control as it should have just been divided down by municipal districts, but as it sits now, it isn't presenting its information in a meaningful way to be useful for travelers. Primecoordinator 12:56, 14 May 2010 (UTC+3)

Lisbon[edit]

Although it was refused some time ago it is more complete now, and it's a very popular tourist destination. —The preceding 188.81.106.36 (talk • contribs)

Not Yet Although I have never been to Lisbon, I have a sneaky suspicion that there is more to see and do in the city than what is listed. Also, the "See" section lacks organization. Districts make better subsections than the arbitrary headings like "Architecture". The transportation information does not really belong in the "See" section. It seems better suited for "Get around". ChubbyWimbus 22:30, 28 October 2009 (EDT)
  • Oppose Lisbon is a fantastic city, and this guide still really doesn't do it any justice. --Stefan (sertmann) talk 02:52, 30 October 2009 (EDT)
  • More criticism wanted. While I completely agree that Lison is 'not there yet', I would welcome more criticism on what is missing and what should be improved. It could help me (and hopefully someone else) in improving the article. --DenisYurkin 16:39, 14 December 2009 (EST)
  • Comments. Some suggestions to improve the article:
  • Understand section is thin. Certainly needs a history sub-section and generally to tell us much more about the city.
  • Do section is tiny - there must be more - theatres, cinemas, sport?
  • Drink only has 3 listings.
  • Get out is full of red links. --Burmesedays 19:55, 14 December 2009 (EST)
  • Should this slushpiled? --Burmesedays 03:35, 29 April 2010 (EDT)

Kawasaki[edit]

I've been involved with Wikitravel - mostly on Japan related articles - for a few years now. Can't believe it's been this long, and yet here I am making my first plunge into a suggestion for DOTM/OTBP. I would like to suggest for OTBP, IF we can expanding the article more or get help doing so, the city of Kawasaki. Overlooked between Kanto's two major cities, Tokyo and Yokohama, it has a charm all its own as well as a few interesting attractions... Kawasaki Daishi being the prime one. It would be a perfect fit for April, since the city's main matsuri occurs at the beginning of the month at Hachimangu. JRHorse 20:52, 19 December 2009 (EST)

  • Support, and agree that it's OTBP -- pretty much off the radar even for Japanese tourists. April is perfect, as it's Iron Penis Festival time as well! Jpatokal 21:06, 19 December 2009 (EST)
I can see a good burb text, but a 1,3 mio population and not a single bar? and one single restaurant? I think most of locals head of Yokahama and Tokyo, but still, at least a drink listing should be added before a feature. --Stefan (sertmann) talk 08:55, 10 January 2010 (EST) Added a Drink listing today, HUB Kawasaki. JRHorse 00:24, 15 January 2010 (EST) This is now lined up for April, but I agree that a few more Eat and Drink listings wouldn't hurt, and the article is still tagged only as "usable". Jpatokal 22:20, 23 February 2010 (EST) Somebody needs to do quite a lot of work on this article before it is featured I believe. It is not even an especially strong usable guide. The See and Get in sections are good but the rest surely lacking?--Burmesedays 22:46, 16 March 2010 (EDT) Well, it now has two more things to "Do" in it at least, in the unlikely event it be reconsidered for 2011 Kawasaki Penis Season (Wikitravel really almost needs a page on penis/boob shrines and festivals across Japan given there are so many). Wish I wrote down a link for that bus tour though, was all over the news last year.Snave 04:10, 19 February 2011 (EST)

Anyone interested in improving this nomination or should it be slushed? ChubbyWimbus 02:14, 20 April 2010 (EDT)

Arusha[edit]

Another nice little article courtesy of a relatively new user, which would be our second ever featured article from Sub-Saharan Africa. --Peter Talk 19:57, 30 March 2009 (EDT)

  • Support and since this more or less smack under the equator, it's good to feature in winter, where we are usually short on good guides to display. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 08:50, 1 April 2009 (EDT)
  • Are there really only 3 things to "See and Do"? (there are four bullets, but the second thing listed to "Do" is leave, which makes it even more noticeable that there's nothing to do/see...) It would be great to feature this (and I like the market photo), but it just seems rather bare. Does it really offer so little? ChubbyWimbus 08:48, 19 April 2009 (EDT)
  • Don't Support —While interesting and helpful to a visitor, I think the "usable" status is very appropriate. There is very little under see & Do (which shouldn't be combined), could possibly use a few more "eat" listings, & the opening of the "sleep" section should be rewritten & include addresses. I agree w/ChubbyWimbus that it is quite "bare". I don't know about attractions there, but it's in the Serengeti and very close to several safari hotspots (Ngorongoro Crater, Lake Manyara, & Tarangire National Park). It's also the largest city near Mount Kilimanjaro (Moshi is much smaller). My guess is that it's more of a base for exploring nearby areas than a tourist destination in-and-of-itself. AHeneen 22:59, 10 May 2009 (EDT)
  • Support, looks well written overall. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 22:05, 15 May 2009 (EDT).
  • Don't support. It's only at usable status, and I agree with AHeneen, not up to guide quality yet. Arusha is primarily a base for surrounding excursions into parks and up mountains, and an overland stop between Nairobi and Dar es Salaam, so should discuss further and point to those options.... eat/drink/sleep all need beefing up and more info, at the moment you wouldn't know that it's probably the most visited place in Tanzania – cacahuate talk 18:02, 9 July 2009 (EDT)
  • Combine Arusha and Moshi as one OTBPArusha has Mt. Meru, Moshi has Kilimanjaro and they both have safaris. If anything, the Moshi article is more informative. If you go to Arusha you will almost certainly go to Moshi, and vice versa (I did!). So why not feature them both?Shep 14:43, 28 August 2009 (EDT)
  • If Arusha and Moshi were both up to standard, then I think they would probably each be able to stand on their own as featured destinations. Currently, the Moshi article is not up to status. If you would like to work on it, some of the issues I notice are
    • It needs pictures
    • change first person to third person in some sentences
    • The "See" and "Other Activities" (in "Do" section) are not formatted properly. The "Add listing" feature will help to fill in the necessary information. Each temple and mosque should be written with their respective names and info
    • This goes along with properly formatting, but specific information is needed. Things like, "Tours can be arranged through several companies, and it is advisable to use common sense when finding a company. Your best bet is to ask other tourists who they used" are not very helpful. Wikitravel is supposed to be the guide, so advising people to "ask other tourists" is not the type of suggestion we want to give. ChubbyWimbus 21:02, 28 August 2009 (EDT)

Olomouc[edit]

The article is already in the guide status but I think there are still things to be improved (I am working on that - comments are welcome). It is probably the most beautiful city in the Czech Republic but unknown to most travelers, so I think it is an excellent destination for the "off the beaten track" category. Probably the best time to visit the city is spring (it is the city of flowers after all) but it needs some work and the queue is full anyway, so I would like to schedule it for spring 2010 - probably April, as it is the time of the traditional flower exhibition. Kyknos 17:33, 20 April 2009 (EDT)

  • Close, but not there yet. Needs more Sleep listings, and almost all listings are lacking proper addresses, contact information, websites, and MoS formatting. In particular, it should never be "X is foo", but "X, address, tel, website. This is..." Jpatokal 06:08, 1 May 2009 (EDT)
  • Support with the same reservations as mentioned above by Jpatokal. Olomouc is a very nice city. It is a bit different from the most visited, western part of Czech republic and should certainly by highlighted. I believe that there is still a lot of time to do the necessary improvements. Atsirlin 03:57, 4 May 2009 (EDT)
  • Not yet. This would be a great destination to feature, but I think the critical deficiencies are the missing addresses throughout the article (shouldn't be too hard to track down for a motivated contributor, I think), and the near empty sleep section. So track down the addresses (at least, although other contact info is obviously desirable), and add at least 3 more hotels, and I think we have an OtBP. --Peter Talk 00:19, 17 July 2009 (EDT)
  • Don't Support To add to what Peter says, the listings are not properly formatted (which I think is likely the reason content is missing from the listings). Also, the "Get out" section is not organized properly. It should focus on directing people to nearby cities, not random attractions. ChubbyWimbus 20:16, 29 August 2009 (EDT)

Las Vegas[edit]

Another one I found while browsing (coincidentally, from the Death Valley article). Although I despise gambling, I think that this article is very good and definitely-DOTM worthy, and unlike Death Valley, this one's already at Guide status. The Restaurants, Bars, and Hotels aren't organized by price like they usually are, but that can be fixed or left alone depending on preference (they are currently organized as to whether or not they are on the Strip). Also, it's nice to see that the article shows some non-gambling things to do there. Like Death Valley, I know little about the time, but I think it's fair to say that this shouldn't be featured in Summer. Rastapopulous 07:34, 19 November 2009 (EST)

Support, obviously. Rastapopulous 07:36, 19 November 2009 (EST)
  • Not quite. At first look this does not seem the most user-friendly article I have seen. It is certainly packed with information (you might argue that there is too much) but the organisation and formatting leaves a bit to be desired. The see and do sections are full of lots of bulleted text which could be better presented as prose IMHO. The sleep sections need either culling (probably) or sorting into price brackets or probably both. Too many get out options. Overall, an information-packed article but needs some organisational work and is too long I would say. --Burmesedays 08:29, 19 November 2009 (EST)
Well, the good news is that there is time to fix all these things up. Rastapopulous 10:26, 19 November 2009 (EST)
  • Not Yet As stated above, the "See" section is lacking a lot of information. Also, I think many of the listings under "See" are actually "Do" (shows, casinoes). Do the strip clubs belong under "Drink" like dance clubs? The organization is just not very good in this article. The "Do" section seems to have an awful lot of text, too.
I don't know Las Vegas well, but are all of those shows permanent shows? One listing has an end date. If there are non-permanent shows there, they should probably not be listed. This article looks like a better candidate for Collaboration of the month. ChubbyWimbus 21:21, 19 November 2009 (EST) I don't know much about Las Vegas either, but I know it is famous for both its casinos and shows...so yes, I don't doubt that all of those are permanent. The listing with an end date, are you referring to "Mama Mia!"? I think that was probably a permanent show but slated to close when the edit was made. AHeneen 20:07, 20 November 2009 (EST)
  • Not quite I'm with Burmeseday...there's lots of information, but it needs to be better formatted. And while I realize that we're supposed to only list attractions once, the city is famous for its casinos...why isn't there a list of casinos? AHeneen 20:07, 20 November 2009 (EST)
  • Isn't it better to districtify this city? It's huge and now there's a big clutter of information on the main page. Globe-trotter 09:57, 20 December 2009 (EST)
Time to slush this?AHeneen 22:16, 21 December 2009 (EST)

2009[edit]

São Paulo[edit]

It is the biggest city in Brazil, and it's very complete.

  • Don't support. It is indeed a very nice guide, but it's not yet at guide status. For guide status, all district articles would need to be at least usable. It also looks like the districts might need to be reorganized a bit to cut down on the large number of them. --Peter Talk 16:35, 4 December 2009 (EST)
  • Don't support, but I would love to see it get up there, always wanted to go. --Stefan (sertmann) talk 16:50, 4 December 2009 (EST)
  • Don't Support There is a lot of work to be done before this article can be featured. Even the name of the article is wrong according to both the Wikitravel Consensus and naming conventions. It should be just Sao Paulo, which was discussed and agreed upon until some user moved everything to this name. That's not to mention all of the issues with the districts...ChubbyWimbus 13:53, 10 December 2009 (EST)

Hyderabad[edit]

Historic city, with lots of attractions. There are still some formatting and content issues to be worked out, but I want this to be in contention for January or February 2010, because in March it will start getting hot. — Ravikiran 10:05, 12 September 2009 (EDT)

Not yet I'd love to see another featured destination from India, and there is time to get this up to standard. You mentioned formatting, and that definitely needs to be addressed in some of the sections. The "Buy", "Do", and "Learn" need more descriptions. If "Work" is to be a part of the city's article, then it definitely needs content. I also think the "See" section would look better if it were organized according to location, rather than attraction type. Right now, I have no idea where any of the attractions are in relation to one another. In the "orientation" section, it seems to state that the city is spread out, which makes it important to know what sites are located near one another and what sites are located in other areas. If it were organized by district, I think that would make it a more useful guide. ChubbyWimbus 18:42, 12 September 2009 (EDT) Thanks. I will work on these. — Ravikiran 07:13, 14 September 2009 (EDT)
  • Support. Great article, lots of detail. The 'Buy' section needs to be tidied, and 'Work' is empty; I'd suggest handling 'Learn' as paragraph rather than a list, and perhaps being more selective, identifying highlights and specialties. Under 'Cope', the bookstores should be in 'Buy', and the list of grocery stores could be collapsed to a couple of sentences identifying the major chains to look for. None of the serviced apartment listings match Wikitravel:Accommodation listings, although DotM candidates needn't be formatted to a tee. Gorilla Jones 19:44, 14 September 2009 (EDT)
  • Not yet I tried cleaning this up a bit a while back, but I'm still not happy with it, a bit to chaotic for my taste, in the streets of Hyderabad I'm sure visitors don't need Wikitravel to add to the mayhem. --Stefan (sertmann) talk 16:50, 4 December 2009 (EST)

Frankfurt[edit]

One of the major destinations in Germany, with a very well written article. It lacks a map, and needs an external links attack, but otherwise looks very much up to DotM standards, I think. Don't know when would be best to feature. --Peter Talk 01:23, 19 August 2008 (EDT)

  • Support. This was actually slushed once way back, but the article has improved by leaps and bounds since then. Definitely a late spring/summer destination though. Jpatokal 02:10, 26 September 2008 (EDT)
  • I'd Support it for February 2009 or around there. Keep smiling, ee talk 00:02, 11 November 2008 (EST).
    • February is still deep winter in Germany at that time. Early fall is also an option though, mid-October was surprisingly pleasant... Jpatokal 02:18, 11 November 2008 (EST)
  • Don't support. Overall a good article, but almost half of the Eat listings don't have descriptions, and almost none of the clubs or hotels have addresses. Gorilla Jones 19:50, 8 December 2008 (EST)
  • Support It's a good article and it would be best in summer s loads of travellers arrive in September for trde fairs.jan 16:09, 24 January 2009 (EST)
  • Don't Support The "Museums" and "Other Museums" are redundant and shows poor organization. The "Skyline" is an odd sub-heading, as well. Not properly formatted. The page doesn't make a very enjoyable read/browse. ChubbyWimbus 02:33, 30 June 2009 (EDT)
  • I'm with Chubby. It is basically a fine article, but not properly organised or formatted so it still needs work. Could it be a Wikitravel:Collaboration of the month? Pashley 00:45, 3 September 2009 (EDT)

Yellowstone National Park[edit]

A UNESCO World Heratige site, the first national park in the world, and a very popular "nature" destination here in the US. It is best in the summer, which looks full right now, but wouldn't be terribly bad in the fall. AHeneen 00:47, 2 March 2009 (EST)

The Tower Roosevelt section needs some information/description, along with the Natural Bridge, but the page looks good to me! There is always that looming issue of too many American destinations, but I have mixed feelings about that. Of course, ideally, the featured destinations would be highly diverse, leaving no nation or area of the world out however, I also feel that if the Wikitravel community chooses to make better pages for countries like the U.S., Japan, and strangely Cambodia has been featured a few times, there is not much that can be done (aside from those who want to see new places featured actually working to get them up to standards). I'd support Yellowstone. ChubbyWimbus 05:09, 3 March 2009 (EST) Don't Support After looking this over again, I think there are way too many listings with either no descriptions or insufficient descriptions. ChubbyWimbus 21:41, 19 November 2009 (EST)
  • Support, with reservations. The article is quite good; I use it, despite being something of a "regular" at Yellowstone. However, as with most US national parks, I'm not convinced that a Yellowstone article shows Wikitravel to best advantage (or vice versa, which is maybe less important). There are two problems. First, there's a great deal of good stuff on line on Yellowstone already, much of it in more coherent form than is true for other DotMs. Second, the "attractions" of the park are not well presented in the limited format that we've imposed on ourselves here. Yes, the article "can" be used in DotM, in that it meets all of the requirements for a DotM article. That doesn't necessarily mean that it should be. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 09:50, 3 March 2009 (EST)

Grand Canyon[edit]

A rather boring dotm, I'd say, but the article is quite well written and has about all the information one needs. --Peter Talk 00:42, 6 February 2009 (EST)

  • Support. Not much wrong with it that I can see, although I trimmed some of the more obnoxious warning boxes. Jpatokal 03:09, 21 February 2009 (EST)
  • Iffy. It is looking pretty good, but there is still a lot more to say.... more info on the treks down Bright Angel, for instance, I think are crucial to a good GC article – cacahuate talk 23:19, 13 May 2009 (EDT)
It seems that the issues Cacahuate brought up have not been addressed, so should this be slushed for now? ChubbyWimbus 02:20, 13 August 2009 (EDT) I say slush it. --Peter Talk 18:24, 13 August 2009 (EDT) Worked a bit on MoS items and added a few pics. Zepppep 15:03, 21 January 2010 (EST)

Fraser's Hill[edit]

Low-key, semi-abandoned colonial hill resort featuring a very different side of Malaysia. Good any time of year, but probably best not listed until they finish fixing up the town square, sometime in "early 2009". Jpatokal 07:26, 13 December 2008 (EST)

I guess I can't say I don't support it on grounds of boringness, but I sort of feel like it's lacking something. Maybe an interesting picture of the birds, if it's so famous for them? It just seems REALLY dull. Hm.. ChubbyWimbus 11:11, 11 March 2009 (EDT)

Faroe Islands[edit]

I think this would be a great place to visit. It's so remote that most people never heard of it. But the landscape and the sustainability of the tourism is definitely worth a trip. —The preceding 93.43.172.58 (talk • contribs)

  • The article is only at outline status, so this isn't a viable candidate. Gorilla Jones 18:36, 31 July 2009 (EDT)

Point Reyes National Seashore[edit]

I can't help but feel this National Park is a hidden gem overshadowed by parks like Yosemite, OTB this article is. There is a great picture, along with a park map. Great place & Great Article. -98.228.6.230 21:14, 5 October 2008 (EDT)

  • Maybe I think the number of US DotM and OtBP destinations have been a little disproportionate. Don't take that as rude (I, myself, am an American), but that's the truth. If we do list another US destination, it should be something "off the beaten path", as in...away from big cities, in the middle of nowhere (somewhat), and someplace many have never heard of (this article meets that, but it is too close to San Francisco). Just my opinion, it's not as if I speak for everyone. AHeneen 19:48, 17 October 2008 (EDT)
  • Maybe. I'll second that maybe. It's interesting, and the article is pretty well done. Is there nowhere to eat there? Only the one place 45 min away at Drake's beach? We should at least put contact info for that place. I think we could use this if we need to fill a slot. But I wouldn't cry if we skipped it either. If it does get featured, I'll do a WT style map for it first – cacahuate talk 15:55, 25 October 2008 (EDT)
  • Support - overall it is pretty good just from a quick look. The only thing that the Buy and Get out areas need more loving and caring! edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 13:05, 14 December 2008 (EST).
Having recently been here, I'm leaning towards not supporting.... this is a destination that relies heavily on nearby areas for lodging and food, and Tomales are in need of TLC. Once it has proper support though from its neighbors, I think this is potentially a fantastic OTBP – cacahuate talk 17:57, 25 May 2009 (EDT)

Edmonton[edit]

I was told that the summer months fill up fast, so I want to propose this now, I suppose! Edmonton is a very touristy city (though you wouldn't think it upon glance): it's got North America's largest mall, vibrant theatre scene, growing retail market outside that mall (a lot already established), Canada's Festival City, Alberta's Captial, Canadas largest historic park, the biggest parkland system in North America, a growing population, and an out of this world job market. The best time would be between May and August. I would support it for June or July. What do you think? I have worked lots on the article and it has gotten praise by many people as being very good. So, from my mind, it's a touristy area (not the likes of Toronto or Tokyo, but holds it's own for it's size) and is a good article. Also, the new Art Gallery of Alberta will be open in March and will be a very amazing gallery that is going to be another major attraction-as opposed to previous when it was meh. Would you support it, gimme your thoughts! If you think there are major areas that need improvement (in the main and distict articles)...point them out for me so I can fix 'em. I don't think theres anything major wrong with it. Your thoughts? Keep smiling, ee talk 17:44, 16 November 2008 (EST).

  • Support. Reads pretty well, has a few maps and photos and probably the most exhaustive coverage of Edmonton anywhere. A couple of the districts are weak in non-touristy areas and not all listings are complete, but I don't think that should hold it back. If we go ahead with it, I'd recommend August -- still summer but a couple months space from DW and SF. Shaund 00:52, 20 November 2008 (EST)
Thanks Shaund. You are right, it is very comprehensive compared to other guides. Why? Because not everything is promoted well and you need to know exactly on the web where to find it or you won't find it. I know all those, which makes a big bonus for Wikitravel. Yeah, there are some non touristy areas-they're kind of the struggle. August would be fine, so long as it's one of the summer months-it'd be cool, Summer is the best time in the city. Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 09:54, 20 November 2008 (EST).
  • Support Well it's the one thing EE is doing right at the moment, so i'll throw in my support. It's quite impressive coverage for a young city this size, a couple of maps, and most of the entries look good. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 19:38, 8 December 2008 (EST)
  • Not yet Two major problems: first, the status on the article is incorrect — Edmonton is at usable status, since at least two of its districts are outlines. Articles have to be guide or better to be featured as DotM. Second, there's a discussion going on right now (see Talk:Edmonton#Districting_-_was_it_truly_necessary.3F) about changing the district hierarchy or scrapping it altogether. Ergo, the article may wind up in a different form than it is now — perhaps better, who knows? — but it needs to be in that form before we can evaluate it here. Gorilla Jones 17:44, 24 May 2009 (EDT)
Um unnecessary. The article will improve for the better anyhow. I've waited a long time for this to be DOTM for a specific time, and it's only fair that it follows through for obvious reasons. Edmonton is also at guide status, so I don't get where you get that from. Two districts are weak, yes, which is why I brought it up. I will be soon merging some of the districts so that problem could be resolved today. Technically Edmonton should be usable status, but just leave it be cause as you brought it up, I'll go and do a merger. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 17:53, 24 May 2009 (EDT).
  • Support contingent on districts being sorted out. WindHorse 22:31, 24 May 2009 (EDT)
Sorry, have you looked at Edmonton? The districts aren't sorted out — the map disappeared, and there are two districts without descriptions called "North" and "South". South is an outline and does not follow the manual of style ("Luxury"), ergo Edmonton is 'usable' per Wikitravel:City_guide_status. The article as a whole is riddled with grammar mistakes, particularly the new History section (which features lively writing such as "In the 1990s, the city was stable economically, but nothing much new happened"). This article needs a lot of work before it's ready to be featured as one of the best of this site. Gorilla Jones 23:43, 24 May 2009 (EDT) Excuse me, I've put a lot of work into those articles, and yes I've made some gramatical mistakes so what lots of articles have some grammatical mistakes. The map is gone, whupee, it's a great map, but it needs an update due to new districts, and am waiting for Cacahuate to help. Not to mention many districted places don't have maps. If I had the map up you'd complain its out of date. Can not win with you. The history section still needs some work, but not everything has to be pristine perfect as the Chicago articles, there are many articles in my opinion that have gone as DOTM. The Edmonton article definitely pushes it's weight above many Wikitravel articles. The districts are sorted out, I just did that today, as I mentioned in the talk. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 00:43, 25 May 2009 (EDT). Point taken, GJ... I've done a quick edit of the history - I just stuck to basic facts and tried to make it appear more travel guide-like and less like a history text book. It still needs works, but at least the grammar should be ok. Cheers. WindHorse 00:54, 25 May 2009 (EDT) Gorilla is absolutely right on all accounts, but we do have a couple more months before this is was be featured, so let's see if it improves in the next month or so. It has come a long way, but it does still need a lot of work, and must be up to guide status (meaning every district should be at least at usable status, no outlines) – cacahuate talk 01:23, 25 May 2009 (EDT)
  • Not Yet If I knew anything about Edmonton, I'd help out, but sadly I don't. However, if this is going to be featured, I think the Edmonton/West End page needs to be revamped. For me, the only thing I know to go to Edmonton for is the mall, and although I realize that is partly my own ignorance, I believe it is definitely the most well-known thing in the city. With that said, the West End page is disorganized and a bit confusing. For example, despite having the largest mall in the world, it states in the "Buy" section, "Most of the West Ends shopping is nothing interesting. Despite it not being a tourist attraction, it could be helpful to a traveller because some people like going to Walmart on vacation or want to know where to get batteries, etc. " This seems like an odd comment to make about the area that holds the largest mall in the world. Is it really only good for buying batteries? Also, I think the information about the mall is disorganized. I don't think it's a "See" thing. A mall is always a "Buy" thing, and this one also has many things to "Do". The sidebox could be trimmed down if the "Do" items inside were taken out and made into their own activity listings. I think that would also help to highlight how big and amazing the mall really is.

edmontonenthusiast: I guess you feel a bit blind-sided since much of these issues were not brought up until now, but try not to take the criticisms personally. You've done some amazing work with this city's page, so don't get discouraged. You are working on a large city, and it seems you are mostly working alone, so I can imagine this is quite tough, but if you reread the articles with the criticim in mind and think about how to better present your city, when it is finally featured, it will really shine, and you can be all the more proud of it! Definitely keep smiling! ChubbyWimbus 13:29, 25 May 2009 (EDT)

Thanks Cacahuate and CW. I think giving it another month or so would be fair, so yeah. Yeah I guess you could say except for the Central and Old Strath-Uni (now South Central - name is more fitting for the area), and in some cases the North it is disorganised. Maybe the reason my writting on West Ed is so terrible is because I really hate it. And comments like yours only further that, you basically only know West Ed, but don't know about Whyte Ave, the festivals, the river valley, the art gallery(ies), the U of A(lberta), 124th street, The legislature, etc. I guess I'm working on getting those things much more well known :). Thanks to the both of ya! edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 16:34, 25 May 2009 (EDT). Well, with the idea that the mall is the city's best known attraction (whether it deserves to be or not), perhaps it will be more bearable for you to make it look worthwhile by keeping in mind that if people are going to Edmonton and see that the mall descriptions are accessively negative or confusing they will be less likely to look at the other pages (which you hope they will look at) and more likely to refer to a more "fun" guide. One of the reasons I began working with the Okayama page was because I felt the guide was excessively negative, and it was obnoxious. Actually, it turned me off of the entire Wikitravel site for a while, until I started contributing to the page myself. This is why I think it's beneficial to the entire Edmonton guide to make the mall look fun for travellers. Of course, if there are some particularly shoddy places or rip-off activities in the mall, I'm not saying you should lie about them, but from personal experience looking at a negative guide, I highly recommend only including negative remarks when you feel that a majority of travellers could feel disappointed or ripped-off by the activity/site. When it is a matter of personal travel preferences, I think it's best to give it nice presentation and let the traveller decide if it's worthwhile for them to visit. ChubbyWimbus 09:51, 26 May 2009 (EDT) The mall is really against a lot of things I "believe in". I hate those suburban piece(s) of trash. I understand what you're saying but if I was visiting Edmonton, WEM would be the last thing on my mind. It's certainly not something I want to promote, and I don't think we should go overboard on making something look so amazing that is so tacky and unoriginal. Many people visit it and are dissapointed, just like they are with the MOA. Megamalls suck. But realistically, that's one of the few things that are "slightly" negative. I still show it's "amazement", like over 800 shops, the amusement park, etc. But thanks for the tip, I'll try to make it seem more uplifting, without it taking away and making it seem like it's the only thing to do. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 15:02, 26 May 2009 (EDT). Come to think of it, I've been to the Mall of America, and I didn't really think it was anything special, but I think these mall attractions, particularly Edmonton's, are a sort of obligatory visit, just to say "I've been to the largest mall in the world!" ChubbyWimbus 09:15, 29 May 2009 (EDT) North America. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 19:37, 29 May 2009 (EDT).
  • Not yet, and I'm concerned about early claims of a consensus that I do not see. There are only two of the current five districts up to guide status at the moment, and there are a lot of writing issues left to work out - some of which will definitely require local knowledge (district descriptions on the main page, say... is "epitome of suburbia" supposed to be a good thing or a bad thing?). However, great strides have been made in listings content, so there's not as much original research to be done as there once was; perhaps it could benefit most from a revised plan for CotM first, allowing time for more section completion and an aggressive bout of copyediting, then DotM in the future? It would take more time, but I would not want to rush an unpolished article through just to catch this year's warm months - as the header says, "timing can be worked out later". - Dguillaime 00:45, 23 June 2009 (EDT)
I've taken Edmonton off the DOTM schedule to make everyone (but me) happy. I'd rather not have to debate this, so why not scrap the whole idea of a DOTM? What do you think? Am I being irrational or not? COTM? I'd made a COTM for Edmonton months ago - NOTHING happened! And I don't think many participate in CotM anyhow. Yes sometimes I word things incorrectly, usually if I read over it I can pick out the mistakes, but sometimes I do not have the time or forget. Really, if the DOTM doesn't happen as planned for months, in August, as it is the perfect time, I am not waiting until August 2010. That's so dumb. Hence the idea of me just scrapping the idea of Edmonton ever getting a DOTM. Maybe I'm being over the top, I don't know. The epitome of suburbia isn't a good thing, by the way. Districts do not have to be up to guide status to be a DOTM, they have to be usable, and the main article has to be Guide. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 01:26, 23 June 2009 (EDT). If your heart is set on making it to dotm by august, then simply get to work and satisfy the current objections.... you still have time. If that happens, then we can consider replacing Okayama then – cacahuate talk 05:02, 23 June 2009 (EDT) I could try. I've been busy lately, but I will have some free time now. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 19:17, 26 June 2009 (EDT).

Preah Vihear[edit]

Off the beaten path but certainly in the news; just named a UNESCO World Heritage site and Thailand and Cambodia are still squabbling over it. Now has a gorgeous new map from Wikimedia Commons. Good more or less any time of the year, perhaps best in the winter though. Jpatokal 05:49, 8 July 2008 (EDT)

Undecided. If "Thailand and Cambodia are still squabbling over it," is it really a good idea to recommend travel to it? How serious is the "squabbling"? Please advise. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 08:54, 8 July 2008 (EDT) Not particularly serious. Thailand occasionally closes off access for a day or two, but it's fully accessible from the Cambodian side (if rather harder to get to). Jpatokal 04:08, 12 July 2008 (EDT) You're positive? This article kinda caught my attention... -- Bill-on-the-Hill 12:00, 20 July 2008 (EDT) Should we create an "adventurous dotm" section for the main page? – cacahuate talk 23:36, 20 July 2008 (EDT) I thought we called that "OtBP". Jpatokal 08:56, 4 August 2008 (EDT) "Off," not "On," and "Beaten," not "Bombarded," "Besieged," "Battlefield..." -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:57, 4 August 2008 (EDT)
  • OK, if the squabbling has died down, I'll support, but let's keep an eye on it. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:29, 2 November 2008 (EST)
    • I've popped this off the list for time being, but mostly because Phnom Penh is about to be featured. Let's see again in late 2009. Jpatokal 07:26, 13 December 2008 (EST)
Best to Wait right now. According to the BBC [11], Thai troops have just taken over the whole temple compound. Not sure if that will mean a skirmish, but that doesn't sound like it will make visiting a safe thing to do. AHeneen 07:10, 25 March 2009 (EDT)
    • If the decision is to wait until Preah Vihear is safe, should it be slushed for the time being? According to this website dedicated to the site [12], the issue was supposed to be brought up at the recent UNESCO meeting, but since it failed to make the agenda, they may have to wait until the next meeting to discuss the issue. It seems like this issue is going to take a long time to resolve. If a resolution is what we are waiting for, maybe it should be slushed for now. ChubbyWimbus 19:01, 4 July 2009 (EDT)

Portland[edit]

This one looks like it has a lot of solid information. The only thing maybe is a map or two (I might be able to do it) and a few more images from my standpoint. Looks well written with lots of images. What do you think? If you think it needs improvement let me know where and I'll try and fix it when I can. the summer or fall months would be best, so maybe 2010? Or we bump October or November I suppose. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 20:02, 19 May 2009 (EDT).

  • User:Bill-on-the-Hill nominated this one a while back, and the primary objection then was a lack of decent photos, something which I think still needs to be addressed. That Downtown Portland photo looks a little drab, and the pic of the MAX train looks more like an artistic photo than a traveler photo to me. Once that's done I think we could still do with at least 3-5 more photos on the page. Otherwise it seems like a pretty good guide - I'd tidy it up a little, add a few more phone numbers, but it's looking good. PerryPlanet Talk 12:41, 4 June 2009 (EDT)
Thanks for the reply. I'd been working lots on this one as the city interests me lots. So I made two maps - I hope they are ok. I was just picking out some good photos from the commons really, but I could find some more. But I want to not upload too many as I'm going there this summer and I'd love to put some of my photos up. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 23:10, 4 June 2009 (EDT).
  • Don't Support I think the problems with this page go beyond simply needing pictures. The "See" section is not organized well at all. Most of it is a listing of neighborhoods that, as far as I could gather, have nothing to see. That's the majority of the listings. It reads like a districtification list rather than a travel page. Also, there is a "Districts" section that seems rather odd. If the page itself is not going to be split into districts, that little section doesn't seem useful. If this is to be featured, the "See" section really needs to be redone. Let people know what there is to see rather than listing neighborhoods. (It's also more helpful to separate listings according to location rather than categories like "museums", "art", etc.) ChubbyWimbus 20:55, 29 June 2009 (EDT)
Made several MoS edits and hope to see the article sparkling soon. Zepppep 16:00, 21 January 2010 (EST)

Stockholm[edit]

Good example of a guide for a large city we haven't distritified, and hence no poor quality outline districts. Good content, a few of the listings are missing phone numbers, and some others opening hours, but overall I still think it's pretty much up to standard --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 14:12, 19 January 2009 (EST)

Support A very good article in my opinion, but should it be districtified? AHeneen 19:12, 20 January 2009 (EST)
  • Oppose. This is almost a textbook example of why a huge-city article should be districtified. Packaged in a single article, the information (which I agree is nice and comprehensive) is unwieldy and inaccessible, and doesn't take advantage of the superior means of organizing information that our district structure offers. Districtify it, then re-propose. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 20:37, 20 January 2009 (EST)
  • Oppose. I think I go with Bill on this one. It's a great article on a great city, but needs to be broken up. WindHorse 22:37, 24 May 2009 (EDT)
OK, so maybe we should scrap this, as the main contributors to the guide have reached a consensus not to districify the city, per the talk page, and I have no intention of going against that. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 07:30, 25 May 2009 (EDT) Agreed. It's got a lot of great information, but until it is split into districts, it's not very useful, and it seems that there is no move to make these changes. ChubbyWimbus 08:35, 25 May 2009 (EDT)

Reykjavík[edit]

Alright, so this time I have discovered an article which is at guide status. Hotels and most restaurants list addresses. The buy section is a bit slim and there is nothing in the work section (but does the work section really matter). Iceland has recently gone bankrupt and the people are clamoring for money that isn't worthless so it would be a destination where the dollar (or pound or euro or loonie) really goes far. Hot springs in an arctic land would make for an interesting late-winter or early spring article (Feb-Apr?), although the best time to visit would be in the summer. AHeneen 04:07, 25 November 2008 (EST)

  • Support- looks fine , but then again I am not very proffessional and it would be outweighed to Stefan or Peter. Keep Smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 10:37, 25 November 2008 (EST).
  • Dubious it's not DOTM yet, but it could get there with a little work, as it is pretty close (might do some myself, maybe we should make it COTM!?) - as far is I'm concerned, there is only one good time to feature this, and that would be during the super cool Iceland Airwaves festival in October, as the town itself is rather dull, Iceland's impressive nature non withstanding. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 20:42, 27 November 2008 (EST)
Sure dunt look boring to me. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 11:25, 2 December 2008 (EST).
  • Almost support. Generally good, but the 'Understand' section stinks, and there's almost no descriptive text in the 'Drink' listings. Gorilla Jones 20:16, 8 December 2008 (EST)

Canberra[edit]

It looks quite solid and shows a lot of information that is useful. It's listings are complete and looks like a neat lil destination. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 14:11, 8 December 2008 (EST).

Almost support. 'Do' section needs to have some sense ironed into it and someone will need to choose a lead image. The concerns about touristic charms from Birmingham above may apply here as well. Gorilla Jones 20:02, 8 December 2008 (EST)

Lisbon[edit]

It's a great article, and an amazing destination for travelling.

  • Not Yet It actually looks pretty good and could probably be considered a guide, except the Cope section appears to have been overlooked. It's there but empty! ChubbyWimbus 11:15, 22 March 2009 (EDT)

Moscow[edit]

It is a great article, and the main destination in Russia. —The preceding 85.247.106.197 (talk • contribs)

  • Oppose. The article is not at guide status. But it's below our standards in a host of other ways as well. It lacks any maps, which is a major problem for a city that has such a confusing street layout in the center. It also needs districts, given that it is one of the world's largest metropolises, the largest in Europe, with more than 10 million residents, excluding the immense undocumented immigrant population (we've been working on a layout on the Russian version btw, which we'll be able to import to here at some point). Having less than 20 restaurants listed for a city of this size (and for a city with a great dining scene) is an embarrassment imo, which should not be broadcast on the front page. --Peter Talk 16:51, 14 April 2009 (EDT)
  • Oppose as well. It is no more than a nice introduction to the city. Moscow is comparable to other large European cities (e.g., London or Berlin) in its diversity, so you can imagine how the Moscow article (actually, the main article and a bundle of district articles) should look like. Since I originate from Moscow, I will readily join a collaboration for improving the article. However, pushing it to the guide status will take pretty long time, and I will not dare do this alone. Atsirlin 18:18, 14 April 2009 (EDT)
  • Oppose. What Peter said. Jpatokal 08:40, 24 April 2009 (EDT)

Porto[edit]

The second biggest city of Portugal and a very famous tourist destination. The article is very complete.

  • Don't support. Not at guide status. --Peter Talk 16:48, 10 May 2009 (EDT)
  • Don't support. Plenty of information, but virtually no complete listings. Gorilla Jones 19:45, 10 May 2009 (EDT)

North_Pole[edit]

I thoroughly enjoyed reading this guide when I bumped into it, well written, has a map, it's not a remote tropical island (in fact it's not even land) but still indisputably off the beaten path --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 15:15, 16 March 2009 (EDT)

It's OK...but its shortness makes me think the article needs more information. Yes, there isn't a lot to be said of the N.Pole, but I really think a little more can be added to this article. AHeneen 03:02, 17 March 2009 (EDT) Don't Support It's interesting, but I agree with the above comment that the content is rather sparse. It's also not at the proper status to be nominated. ChubbyWimbus 03:05, 20 April 2009 (EDT)

Ethiopia[edit]

A very complete article, and not a very known tourist destination.

Countries shouldn't be nominated before all linked articles from the main page are are guide level/status. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 10:53, 24 March 2009 (EDT) I've looked at the Ethiopia pages before and I don't believe there is a single Ethiopian city that could be nominated, the regions have no information or almost none... I would love to see an Ethiopian destination featured, but if you want that to happen, I'd suggest first updating a city and then nominating it once it has enough information to reach guide status before nominating the entire nation. ChubbyWimbus 05:25, 25 March 2009 (EDT)

Portugal[edit]

The article is very complete, and it's a famous turist destination.

It's only at Usable status, and some of the cities listed are broken links, and most of the other cities and region links don't contain much information. If a nation is to be featured, I think at least the major cities and regions should be at usable status. ChubbyWimbus 11:25, 10 March 2009 (EDT) Indeed the large region that comes close at the moment is Northern Territory, but I'd like to see all destinations have guides before we feature that. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 11:56, 10 March 2009 (EDT)

Ohrid[edit]

I found this in the archive from last year, however it seems greatly improven and very rich in information. It is interesting and very intriguing. Seems there is a Ohrid Summer Festival starting in June, so I would have this one in June as OTB.—The 69.230.160.94 (talk • contribs) .

Still don't support. Please don't fish things out of the slush pile unless you've made significant changes to the article since the last nomination, and have fixed any previous objections. Get around tells nothing really of how to get around, what it costs, etc... I don't get an idea of the size of the town, what it will cost to get from one side to the other, etc. Eat listings are all lacking descriptions, addresses, etc. Once this town gets an overhaul, a lot of expansion, a map, and is at least a guide quality article, it will be a great choice. Until then, please don't bring it back continually – cacahuate talk 22:10, 17 January 2009 (EST) Don't Support It's still a long way for the article.jan 16:02, 24 January 2009 (EST)

Galapagos[edit]

Popular place but still off beat. Took a look through it and information is valid and pretty good to use as a destination. Due to it's popularity, it only seems fitting for it to be a Of the beaten path, in my opinion. I really don't see anything wrong with it. I am sorry if this is a stupid nom, it just looked good. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 16:04, 19 December 2008 (EST).

Pyongyang[edit]

A destination that is truly off the beaten path, Pyongyang would make quite an interesting addition to the list. —The preceding 59.190.38.7 (talk • contribs)

If this does get featured, it should definitely be in April to coincide with the Arirang Festival, which is said to be an amazing spectacle. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by ChubbyWimbus (talkcontribs)
  • Don't support - I agree it's an intriguing destination, but the content is not really up there to say the least - which I know is hard - but still --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 11:31, 17 February 2009 (EST)
  • Don't support — I'll repeat Sertmann...it's certainly an interesting destination, but it needs a lot more content (guide status) before being featured. If it is, August would be better for the Mass Games. AHeneen 22:34, 17 February 2009 (EST)
  • Don't support. Same observation as the last two, but if someone would make the effort to get the article up to Guide quality, I could be persuaded to change my mind. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 18:08, 24 February 2009 (EST)

Nako[edit]

Pretty place, and its status in the hard-to-get-to "Restricted Zone" brings a whole new meaning to "Off the Beaten Path." Don't be put off by the sparseness of the Eat and See/Do sections; can't talk about what's not there. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:48, 2 November 2008 (EST)

Seriously? No offense, but how is this a GUIDE article? It is so tiny and even if there isn't much to do I am sure you could have added a bit of OOPH to it. Sorry for ranting, it just seems out of place. I don't get it. Personally I wouldn't nominate it yet, you just need to add some wording additionally to what you've got! NO FOR NOW.Keep smiling, Edmontonenthusiast 11:51, 2 November 2008 (EST)
  • Objections for a place located in a restricted zone, and hence probably hard to get to, the get in section needs some work. Also I'd like some more information about why i should go through the trouble of going there (see/do) just some prose would be fine. Otherwise i find it very interesting Sertmann 11:53, 2 November 2008 (EST)
    • Inner Line Permits are a hassle, but they're a formality -- they're not going to reject you unless the village has just been taken over by al-Qaeda. Jpatokal 10:46, 11 November 2008 (EST)
  • Undecided. I wrote most of the article, and yes EE, it's about as "guide" quality as this article will ever get! While I love love loved this village, it has very little infrastructure, and can't support a lot of attention. I'm not sure if we've touched on that subject at Wikitravel before, but it's something LP is keenly aware of when choosing to feature destinations. As for the concerns with the article, the thing that would make it clearer is a map on the Kinnaur and Lahaul and Spiti pages, which would put things in perspective... There's only 1 road that loops through those two valleys, and if you take it all the way around from either direction you'll pass by Nako. The Nako article isn't really the place to describe that, the article assumes (rightly) that anyone reaching Nako will already have a very good sense of what they're doing. FYI, there's faaaar more info here than even LP devotes to it (or how to get to it). Lastly, I'd almost prefer to wait until Lahaul and Spiti or Kinnaur are up to speed, along with the major stops along the way, and feature them as little regions... that's the only way that anyone visits them anyhow, you don't go into this area to just see one specific place like Nako, you do the loop (or half of it, anyway) – cacahuate talk 20:33, 2 November 2008 (EST)
We've featured more "forbidding" (and "forbidden") places than this before, e.g. Panmunjeom, which also has durn little infrastructure for tourism. Part of the idea behind OtBP is identifying places that are really off the beaten path, not just to alert travelers to their existence but to make the point that Wikitravel can treat such places better than written guides can, exactly as you point out. I don't see the remoteness and restrictions of this place as a disqualifier. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:27, 2 November 2008 (EST) Well, I've cleaned it up a little, and added more detail on getting in to the Lahaul and Spiti and Kinnaur articles. I also drew a map for Himachal Pradesh, so hopefully it's becoming a little more clear where the heck this is and how to get there. It is otbp for sure, and it is interesting, but I really feel like it should be the whole region that is featured as otbp when it's ready. I won't withhold support though, if we need to fill a slot. July thru September is probably the best time to feature – cacahuate talk 02:37, 3 November 2008 (EST) I agree with Cacahuate. The Kinnaur region would probably be a better candidate for showcasing than this village (which I believe I trekked to some years ago), but will go with majority ruling, and neither support nor object. `WindHorse 11:08, 3 November 2008 (EST) Actually, Panmunjeom is visited by tour buses daily, so while it's unusual, it's not that off the beaten path... but I agree that featuring a slightly larger region would be good. Jpatokal 10:46, 11 November 2008 (EST) Should there be a "stay safe" section????? Anyways, I agree that a slightly larger region should be featured. This town is very small and the description is quite short...it just doesn't make me want to get up and start planning my trip there. The article may be as good as it possibly can be, but there just needs to be more substance for a featured OtBP article. AHeneen 22:36, 3 December 2008 (EST) No need for stay safe section, very quiet and stable area. At the moment this is near perfect for what I think it should be, but I also have concerns about trying too hard to sell tiny destination with no infrastructure... and also, half of what's special about this place is its remoteness and the fact that it's a bit off the trail for most people, even among those that come to this region. So writing a fabulous salesman intro that makes you want to go there, to me anyway, is not at all what the article needs, and would then probably let down the tourist who decided to make the journey based on that sell. If that makes sense – cacahuate talk 23:38, 8 December 2008 (EST)

2008[edit]

Walt Disney World Resort[edit]

This article is chock-full of detail and has a Guide status. It deserves to be Star, especially by this coming January, which is when "The American Idol Experience" will open.

  • Discuss -- carefully. The article is terrific, no doubt about that, and it stands on its own merits. However, it is a radical departure from our usual DotM practice to feature a privately-owned resort with a single, commercial operator. I'm not sure that disqualifies Disney World -- it certainly does meet the criteria for "destination" -- but let's not rush into this one without thinking through the issues. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 13:18, 4 September 2008 (EDT)
  • Support. The article is excellent, and I don't see a problem with featuring it — it's clearly a valid article, and so it's OK for DOTM in my book. Jpatokal 23:10, 4 September 2008 (EDT)
  • Support. It's a great article, and I'm sure it'll be Star by the time it's featured as DotM. Walt Disney World is well-known enough, and the article is well-written enough, that I feel comfortable going against precedent. --Tally talk 23:10, 1 October 2008 (EDT)
  • Support. Great article. I'll agree with Jani—as long as it meets our article criteria, it should be allowable as a DotM/OtBP, regardless of the inherent weirdness of having a resort as our featured article. I'd give scheduling priority to more traditional DotM nominations, but I suppose this could be scheduled any time of the year (probably any time other than crowded summer would be best). --Peter Talk 00:20, 2 October 2008 (EDT)
Er, let me append that by saying that huge airports, despite meeting our article criteria, should definitely not every be featured. --Peter Talk 00:27, 2 October 2008 (EDT) I wouldn't got that far -- I'd be happy to feature one if the article ever becomes star/guideworthy. I just don't see that happening though, because few Wikitravellers are willing to put in the elbow grease for (say) documenting every restaurant in Heathrow... Jpatokal 03:42, 3 October 2008 (EDT)
  • Don't Support for all the reasons listed by Bill-on-the-Hill (first comment). Personally having been there several times, and living 50mi(80km) from it, I can say this: it is expensive, very commercial, and lacking in any form of "culture". While it is indeed a great place to visit, it can be plagued by long lines on weekends, around Christmas/New Year, and all summer (April-September). My biggest concern is that there really isn't much culture involved except for Epcot and it's lake surrounded by representations of several nations (they also hire lots of diverse persons). The cost of such a trip should be considered too...the admission is high, food prices and snacks are expensive, shopping/stores on the premises are expensive, and anyone planning to stay at the resort should be prepared to pay a lot for a room. Also, if one considers the vicinity, Orlando and Kissimmee are somewhat lacking in culture (save a couple of VERY small enclaves of Indians and Vietnamese). While it is a great article and a great place to visit with children, I do not believe it is worthy of being a DotM for the preceding reasons. AHeneen 19:41, 17 October 2008 (EDT)
I'm not sure that anything you mentioned should disqualify it. It's a destination, one of the most popular travel destinations in the world, and it's one of the better articles we have on the wiki. Culture value doesn't disqualify an article from DotM status, and even if it did, there's a strong argument to be made that Disney World and its commercialism is a good representation of American culture, in all its excess. As for expense, that's not relevant; a lot of our featured destinations are rather expensive to visit. --Tally talk 14:35, 25 October 2008 (EDT) Let me be clear that I was not "voting against" the article; I was simply saying that the issues need to be discussed, as is occurring. I still haven't decided whether I support this as a DotM or not, but the things I raised were intended as points to ponder rather than as show-stoppers. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 17:50, 25 October 2008 (EDT)
  • Support Although i would not set my own feet there in a million years - it's a very nice article, and one of the worlds biggest tourist draws. Sertmann 08:33, 3 November 2008 (EST)
  • Don't Support. If we're going to expand this article with districts and whatnot -- which is something I'd like to get started on over the next few months -- I strongly suggest we wait before showcasing it as DotM. LtPowers 18:51, 8 December 2008 (EST)

Balatonfüred[edit]

This article is full of beautiful pictures and excellent detail of one of Europe's most unheard of tourist resorts, for the Westerners at least. Balatonfüred, Lake Balaton, has a beautiful charm and is one of Hungary's oldest Spa Towns. Surrounded by stunning countryside and mountains, yet still posessing a waterpark and an amazing town bustling with life, this surely is the destination of alifetime.

The Article has Guide Status and contains maps and indeed travel information.

Both maps in this article have been recommended for deletion on shared. Please address this issue there. --Peter Talk 19:00, 4 September 2008 (EDT)

Both Maps have now been deleted, with a new legal one put in place.

Jakarta[edit]

Developing as one of major cities in Asia, Jakarta is one great destination. It has the best shopping destination as a lot of shopping centers were built in this city. Let's not forget about Ancol Dream Park, which consists of Dunia Fantasi (Fantasy world), Sea World, Ocean Park, beach, resort, hotel, and great restaurant. Personally, it's even better than Hong Kong Disneyland. Perfect weather comes in May through August.

  • Don't support, yet. While I do readily agree that Jakarta the city is better than Hong Kong Disneyland — for example, Jakarta has far better street food, shopping malls and strippers — Jakarta the article is in pretty poor shape. There's actually a lot of content in there, but the districting is really half-assed and much of it has been mangled by non-native speakers. Jpatokal 03:57, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
  • Not yet. While I wouldn't say it's half-assed, I mean, thats a little harsh in my books. It's hard work districting. Though, it needs more work and maybe just give it anotehr month and work on it;)! Keep smiling, Edmontonenthusiast 11:38, 3 November 2008 (EST).

Osaka[edit]

Looks like a solid article. edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 21:03, 27 November 2008 (EST).

  • Needs work. The sleep section for starters, anything that employs the {{style}} template probably isn't quite there yet – cacahuate talk 02:02, 28 November 2008 (EST)
  • Needs work. What cacahuate said. Plus the Drink section is pretty inadequate. More than half of the section is things I put in there without even knowing the city all that well. There are tons and tons of bars and clubs there. Surely there are places worthy of recommendation other than the handful i happen to know. Texugo 02:06, 28 November 2008 (EST)
  • Needs work. That Sleep section, in particular, is a total mess. Jpatokal 03:35, 28 November 2008 (EST)

Buffalo National River[edit]

A forever pristine environment, located well out of sight from Little Rock, Arkansas or Springfield, Missouri.

  • Not yet. The seeds of a very good OtBP are there, but it's awfully wordy, has barely sufficient Eat/Drink information, and needs some MoS work. (However, I wouldn't bother replacing the maps, even though they're out of compliance with our standards; they "work" because of the unusual nature of this destination.) A campaign to get the article cleaned up in time for spring 2009 would be well received. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 09:43, 1 July 2008 (EDT)

Ohrid[edit]

Great article, well balanced and especially July is the best time to visit since they have the Ohrid Summer Festival. (One of the best music events held under open skies in The Antique Theater overlooking the lake, is Aug 2nd).

" Archaeological finds indicate that Ohrid is one of the oldest human settlements in all of Europe. The lake itself is over three million years old. Ohrid town is first mentioned in Greek documents from 353 B.C.E., when it was known as Lychnidos - or, “the city of light.” ". Read it and experience it...

  • Support. I was there last year and this destination is "must-feel" in a life time, and the article is true to it.Hoh 18:18, 19 June 2008 (EDT)
  • Support. Yes looks like a good article and the place seems unique and interesting, why not.
  • I Support it. Very interesting and objectively written article. Definitely support, go with it. But I noticed there are few good pictures in the article, do you think this is the best one to have on the main page? I am not sure, I could not put my finger on the best one.Celia 21:47, 19 June 2008 (EDT)
  • Oppose. Looks like a lovely destination, but at first glance: the "get around" section is blank, "see" listings lack any directional or contact info, no "buy" listings, no address/directional info for "eat" listings, no "drink" listings, the Wikitravel:External links policy is violated numerous times, all listings should be listingified, "sleep" listings should have price listings, the photo gallery violates Wikitravel:Small city article template. Moreover, shoving this into the July slot without even waiting a week to see if anyone objects to this as the DotM was totally inappropriate, and against the rules set on this page. --Peter Talk 23:25, 19 June 2008 (EDT)
    • Support These are minor structural changes that you are welcomed to go and make Peter. The article is however full of substance, is objective and easy to navigate and it will be a pity not to be featured in July when most events there happen. As for people being able to comment, it has been on the wikitravel site for some time and people have modified it for a long time. There are "buys" listings and as I understand the listed places are well famous there, while street addresses not so much, so the name is more than enough. I think what one has to have in mind is that different places have different distribution of priorities and information and a good article should reflect that, as does this one.
      • No, those are not minor problems. This page is about showcasing good articles, not just nice places to go. Jpatokal 06:42, 22 June 2008 (EDT)
  • Oppose. First of all, you're only allowed to vote support once. Secondly, the article is ineligible for the reasons that Peter listed. Those are not "minor structural changes" - they're requirements. There's a lot of good writing in the article, but a lot of articles on this site have a lot of good writing - the ones we feature are the ones where someone has done the hard, boring work that's really useful to the traveler, like finding addresses and opening hours and prices. Since you keep promoting objectivity as a virtue of the article, you may wish to review Wikitravel's Be fair and Tone. As I understand it, they're planning to include the month of July in 2009 as well, so you may be able to have it in shape by then. (Note that Mount Fuji has been in queue since April 2007.) Gorilla Jones 08:26, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
  • Support I just explained at the Fuji section since it is just a matter of timing and both are good articles, lets have Ohrid in July and Mount Fuji in August. Ohrid Summer Festival in July looks great and the technical polishing I will try to do please join me. Miko 09:19, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
  • Not yet. Interesting article, but it needs serious editing. (BTW, please sign your contributions to this discussion.) -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:44, 20 June 2008 (EDT)
    • Incidentally, once the concerns about readiness have been resolved, I see this more as OtBP than DotM. No town (as opposed to "park") that we have featured for DotM since the creation of OtBP has had a population as small as Ohrid's 42,000 (Wikipedia), and the "beaten path" in Macedonia lies elsewhere (e.g. Skopje). I could definitely see this article as OtBP for June 2009, once it's been cleaned up; that's exactly the right timing for the summer festival. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 13:46, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
      • On this point I do agree with the nominators -- Ohrid (the entire lake area, not just the town) is Macedonia's top draw and definitely the most destination-y place in a rather OtBP country. But this, too, should be sorted out better: is the article's focus the town of Ohrid or the region of Ohrid? Jpatokal 06:35, 22 June 2008 (EDT)
  • Support. I have been in Ohrid few years ago and I know entire Skopje goes there in the summer, so it is definitely the "beaten path" in Macedonia. (Is Mount Fuji more populated than Ohrid?) What needs to be cleaned up to have it ready for July? Because as it stands now we have two mountain destinations, so to add diversity and accommodate that Ohrid is most interesting in July, I would also push for clean up changes in the Ohrid article and have it in July, and Mount Fuji in August. ElenaJ 16:17, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
  • Not yet. It definitely has potential, but I also agree with everything Peter says above... once those things are fixed I'd support for OTBP in an appropriate season. Also, Elena/Hoh/Celia, etc, please stick to one user account, you aren't accomplishing anything by voting under multiple usernames – cacahuate talk 17:11, 21 June 2008 (EDT)
To clarify on Cacahuate's point, we don't use majority rule voting on Wikitravel, we work by consensus. Moreover, if you read that consensus article, you'll understand that simply voicing an opinion isn't relevant, you need to make arguments per policy or established practice. --Peter Talk 17:27, 21 June 2008 (EDT) Word – cacahuate talk 18:51, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

Bern[edit]

A stunning city that combines a truely Swiss stadt with a global and diverse capital city. Bern would be a flexible option because the city and the area has much to offer all year long. Article is complete in many categories however some headings with no comment should be deleted and maybe more photos could be added. But I definitely believe that Bern should be considered. --AZGSB9 18:06, 19 March 2008 (EDT)

  • Do not support -- strongly. We shouldn't be using "Usable" city articles for DotM. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 17:57, 12 April 2008 (EDT)
  • Oppose, for the moment. Contentwise, I'd call the article a guide, but it does need some cleanup. Jpatokal 02:02, 13 April 2008 (EDT)

Zermatt[edit]

A small, car free village set below the jaw-dropping Matterhorn is what Zermatt is. One must take a train or a helicopter to get here in the first place, but is it ever worth it. The truth is, there are many tourists here, but the fact that is isolated, picturesque, and has a very complete article makes this a very viable option for OtBT.

  • Not yet. This article has enormous potential (it's a great destination) but needs a great deal of de-touting and MoS work. "See" and "Do" both need a great deal of expansion, and details are needed on lodging -- without external links. I'd love to see it put into shape that we can consider it for OtBP, but it's a long way from that point. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:36, 30 November 2007 (EST)

Sydney[edit]

I think this city could make it as a DotM and is definitely a super touristy area. Maybe May 09 or something? Thoughts? Keep smiling, ee talk 19:51, 16 November 2008 (EST).

Perhaps it could be a cotm first. Although Sydney is quite complete, just one level down at Sydney/City, Sydney/The Rocks, and Sydney/Chinatown it is decidedly bare... Also if I had to pick a time to showcase it, it would be the southern spring. rather than winter, so maybe a September target.. --Inas 21:28, 16 November 2008 (EST) Alright, you'd have time to work for that, that's for sure! Keep smiling, ee talk 23:35, 16 November 2008 (EST).

Ville D'Quebec[edit]

Looking over Quebec City, it looks like it would be a fantastic DotM. I would probably say for WInter time. Either 08-2009 winter or 2009-10 winter. What do you think ? Keep smiling, ee talk 12:32, 17 November 2008 (EST). February has the Carnaval so that'd be interesting. Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 13:54, 17 November 2008 (EST).

  • Don't support. It looks like a lovely place, and the guide is pretty decent, but some of the See and Do listings seem rather lacking. Besides, an article has to be at least "guide" status before it can be DotM. PerryPlanet Talk 13:08, 19 November 2008 (EST)
Oh boy I always for get to look for the status....errgh! Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 13:51, 19 November 2008 (EST).
  • Don't support, yet. I think it'll be a great DotM someday, but still needs some work. There must be some good restaurants outside of the Old Town and the Get out section could be better. A map would be nice too (at least of the Old Town)! Shaund 00:52, 20 November 2008 (EST)

Denver[edit]

Would make a cool Summer destination, or maybe winter. Lush mountains, big population, liveable downtown, Aspen, etc. What do you think-Aug 09 or Nov 09? Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 21:33, 18 November 2008 (EST).

  • Do not support. This has a lot of work to do yet. As much of the city's attractiveness stems from its proximity to knockout outdoors stuff, that outdoors stuff should be described by high-quality articles before the city itself is featured. Many of the in-town listings are rather perfunctory as well. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 09:12, 19 November 2008 (EST)
Adding on to what Bill said, Denver is still at "usable". An article has to be at least "guide" to be DotM. PerryPlanet Talk 13:04, 19 November 2008 (EST)

Tokyo[edit]

Don't know Tokyo very well but it looks like it'd be a good article. I presume this city would be best anytime or during summer. Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 18:33, 20 November 2008 (EST).

Not sure about this one, while the main article is probably up to standard, some of districts are in a sorry state, and not something I would want to showcase. And one more thing of note, I can't think of any other city where district maps is more important than in Tokyo - As anyone who has ventured into this - the greatest of all urban jungles - will testify; for the most part you're simply not going to find a place unless you have it plotted on a map. --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 19:28, 20 November 2008 (EST) Hehehehe, well we'll see some more opinions ;). Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 19:30, 20 November 2008 (EST). Don't support. I agree with Shaund: the Tokyo districts are highly uneven in quality (and even their borders are suspect, see the long but abortive redistricting discussion on Talk:Tokyo), and the lack of maps is major issue. Jpatokal 00:01, 21 November 2008 (EST) Stefan. Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 00:19, 21 November 2008 (EST).

Yerevan[edit]

The other Caucasus nations have had a town featured (Sheki, Azerbaijan & Gori, Georgia). To me, the only negative thing about the article is that the "see" and "do" sections are just lists of places with short descriptions...could elaborate a bit more. It is also only a "useable" article...MoS? -- AHeneen 23:42, 22 November 2008 (EST)

  • Don't support. That article has come a long way, but it lacks a single buy listing, and none of the listings have addresses. --Peter Talk 00:15, 23 November 2008 (EST)
Which is a pitty, cause it's a mighty fine article --Stefan (sertmann) Talk 00:46, 23 November 2008 (EST)
  • It is so so close but not ready for it not to mention it is usable. A lot of it is just plain listings. Keep Smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 01:07, 23 November 2008 (EST).

Antarctica[edit]

Has improved by leaps and bounds since being COTWed. The only accessible season is Nov-March. Jpatokal 13:13, 5 October 2008 (EDT)

  • Not yet. I can't imagine an OtBP that doesn't have "See" and "Do" sections, particularly one where "seeing" is really the main reason for going there. That needs to be fixed. Incidentally, the lead time for preparing for Antarctic travel is so long that I could easily see the article featured as early as August or so, even though you'd normally never dream of going there then. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 19:20, 5 October 2008 (EDT)
I think we'll get Antarctica up to DotM status by the end of the CotM—I'll cast a vote then. I've particularly been meaning to get rid of other destination sections and roll them all into see. --Peter Talk 01:40, 6 October 2008 (EDT) I second that...this should be a DotM, not an OtBP article! AHeneen 21:11, 17 October 2008 (EDT)
  • In a few months if it gets edited a little bit further, then yes. It should be DotM though.Edmontonenthusiast 14:54, 25 October 2008 (EDT)
  • This seems like the very definition of "off the beaten path". Why would it be DotM? LtPowers 13:30, 7 November 2008 (EST)
I'd call this a DotM too. We don't have a very clear consensus on what makes an article either dotm or otbp, but my sense is that the most important thing is the obscurity, rather than the inaccessibility of the destination. Our main goal with the otbps is to showcase our ability to cover destinations that ordinary travel guides never would due to their obscurity (and there are plenty guides to Antarctica). As a matter of fact, since the LP guide is 380 pages,[13] that makes me kind of loathe to support this article as it currently is—I think it needs more research. So: Don't support. Hopefully we can build this up and nominate it again in the future. --Peter Talk 14:06, 11 November 2008 (EST) I don't entirely agree with the part about "obscurity" vice "inaccessibility." Quite a number of our OtBPs have been places that are reasonably well known, just far enough from the main arteries that it requires some effort to go there. OTOH, your point about the LP guide is utterly compelling; we are probably never going to get this article to a state where it really shows off Wikitravel, in contrast to the other OtBP possibilities. Accordingly, I'm changing my vote to do not support. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 17:04, 11 November 2008 (EST)

Northern Armenia[edit]

Lovely in the Spring! Raffikojian 19:20, 27 October 2008 (EDT)

Pretty good so far, no doubt about that for sure! But it is useable (or Usable for you Americans :P) and needs to be Guide or Star. Also, some sections are empty (or contain little information) that should be fille,d most definately ;)! So, since you say it's so good in the spring, why don't you set a goal. Try and get all this done, or get other help by at the latest February, then nominate again for maybe April or May or something of the like:)! Don't you worry, you have time and you don't need to do much. I hope to see this on the front page in the next year :)! Keep smiling, Edmontonenthusiast 19:25, 27 October 2008 (EDT)
  • Do not support. It's certainly emerging as a fine article, but not there yet, and we should also resolve whether the area being covered fits the size criterion at the top of this page -- articles on overly large regions are generally disparaged as DotMs and OtBPs. That one can be debated, but for now, I have some doubts. (And yes, I get the incongruity of this complaint right below the Antarctica nomination, but that one's kind of a special case.) -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:33, 27 October 2008 (EDT)

Banff[edit]

Major touristy area and could be done anytime of the year. Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .t.a.l.k. 12:51, 17 November 2008 (EST).

  • I'm kind of wondering if I can comment on whether I like it or not. Well, just to try-I support. Looks "luvvy juvvy." Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 16:39, 19 November 2008 (EST).
  • Don't support. It's a cool destination, but... the article is only usable, there aren't a whole lot of addresses or directions in the listings and I'm a bit worried there is only one listing in the See section (this is one of the most beautiful spots in the country, after all!). I'm also not sure if this is OtBP or DotM material. It's a small place, but according to Wikipedia, it's tied with Calgary for getting the most visits in the province, plus it's a popular spot on a lot of coach and backpacker tours. Perhaps it would be better to bundle it up with the National Park, Jasper, the Icefields Parkway, etc and do a Canadian Rockies or Alberta Rockies DotM when all the articles are ready? Shaund 01:22, 20 November 2008 (EST)

Rapid City[edit]

Looks pretty good, and though small is home to a lot of really neat tourist spots. Most notably crazy horse and mt rushmore. Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 14:05, 17 November 2008 (EST).

  • Do not support. Only at usable status, and for good reason—it's not nearly comprehensive enough to do justice to the city, and almost none of the listings have sufficient contact information. Also, the city itself isn't very interesting—the surrounding areas are the main draws. I'd rather see us put up Badlands National Park, but it too is not up to dotm/otbp standards yet. --Peter Talk 14:52, 18 November 2008 (EST)
Good point. Maybe a CotM. Thanks. Your a pal! Keep smiling, edmontonenthusiast [ee] .T.A.L.K. 14:54, 18 November 2008 (EST)!

2007[edit]

Baku[edit]

In a part of the world that's been curiously neglected by our DotMs, and a well-constructed, if comparatively terse, article that has been featured as a CotW. Not clear when the best time would be; Wikipedia describes the climate of Baku as "hot and humid in the summer, cool and wet in the winter." That seems to leave spring and fall; might this be an option for November? -- Bill-on-the-Hill 10:02, 7 June 2007 (EDT)

I'd love to see this get featured, but maybe when a few of the other cities in Azerbaijan are more complete, especially the ones in the Get out section - currently Sheki is the only one in the list that is at a reasonable level. Secondly, is Baku not more of an OtBP destination rather than a DotM??? -- Tim (writeme!) 06:43, 13 June 2007 (EDT) Fair point about other cities, but the largest city and national capital of a reasonable-sized, strategically-placed country, with a city population of 2,000,000 or so, doesn't really seem OtBP to me. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 12:25, 13 June 2007 (EDT) Hmmm maybe, but I personally consider Azerbaijan off the beaten path as it is most definitely off the path trodden by your average traveller... -- Tim (writeme!) 12:37, 13 June 2007 (EDT) Being OtBP is a relative question — the next one scheduled has a population of 6.2 million, but (aside from us obsessive travelers) nobody's ever heard of it! Jpatokal 13:15, 13 June 2007 (EDT) Good article. I'd support it for OtBP given the region's obscurity as a travel destination, though I'd like to see some verbiage to accompany at least some of the MoS-licious data about what I can expect to find at the listed bars, cafes and restaurants. Gorilla Jones 13:44, 13 June 2007 (EDT)
  • My philosophy about determining whether or not a place is an OtBP destination includes the question – how easy is it to get into the place? Lufthansa has three flights a week from FRA, British Airways appears to have daily flights from London, however, a round trip flight seems to cost $1,400+. Plus, visitors need a visa to enter Azerbaijan. It's possible for travelers to get a visa at the Baku airport, however, you'll need to get a visa before your arrival if you intend to cross the border in another way. The mere logistics of planning a trip to Azerbaijan (let alone Baku) is daunting enough to say it's not a DoTM candidate. Even if someone suggested this as a OtBP candidate I could not support its candidacy because it doesn't meet MoS (even generally). Specifically, the problems are not all listings have addresses, or at the very least directions. Plus, there are some listings with absolutely no descriptions, which doesn't help me and I absolutely need information that will help my stay. Until then, I do not support. -- Sapphire • (Talk) • 13:52, 13 June 2007 (EDT)
Would support for OtBP after some clean up. There is still too much use of second person language and a lack of addresses - almost there...WindHorse 12:10, 14 June 2007 (EDT) Could ya'll let us know what needs to be changed to make the Baku and other Azerbaijan pages ready for OtBP nominations? I want to make it as good of a page as possible. Thanks! Cupcakecommander 08:39, 18 June 2007 (EDT) Sure, for a city of two million I'm flabbergasted that there are so few activities and sites for visitors to visit. Even Cincinnati, a city of 300,000+ has more activities and sites for travelers to visit than what's currently listed in the Baku guide. I'd be stunned if there wasn't far more to tell our readers about. I'm also having a big problem with the "Get in" info. Under the "Ferry section" it lists Russia and Iran, but doesn't elaborate on how to get from Iran/Russia to Baku. Also, there needs to be more descriptions of restaurants, hotels, activities, and sights. -- Sapphire • (Talk) • 17:05, 18 June 2007 (EDT)

Paarl[edit]

Good article for a continent we haven't featured much. Not sure of the best time to visit. -- DanielC 17:34, 25 April 2007 (EDT)

  • I'd like to see the non-listing aspect of this article fleshed out a bit more first. - Todd VerBeek 17:52, 25 April 2007 (EDT)
  • Good, but not good enough. Eat and Sleep listings need prices, Sleep should also be split into Bud/Mid/Spl. Drink section needs a little more info. Jpatokal 18:33, 25 April 2007 (EDT)
  • NJR_ZA 01:34, 26 November 2007 (EST)

Belfast[edit]

Was nominated a while back, but put in the slush pile with a few objections. I have made the required changes to it and figured it could go back onto the list. We definately shouldn't put this as the dotm outside of the summer... it rains alot in Ireland. The article could do with a few more pictures, but it is more or less ready as it is. For previous objections, see why Belfast got slushed. Tim 11:34, 14 August 2006 (EDT)

  • Support, with reservations; "Eat" and "Sleep" are still pretty thin for a major destination. The rest of the article is in good enough shape, and these two sections at least have some entries that would help a traveler, but improvements would still be appropriate. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 08:48, 15 August 2006 (EDT) I withdraw my support. There are a number of MoS issues, and some "tout" problems have started to appear. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:51, 28 October 2006 (EDT)

Berlin[edit]

It's an interesting city and would be perfect for spring 2007. It may need some more content for the districts but more or less it's complete. Jan 05:20, 24 July 2006 (EDT)

  • Support, but alot of the info needs to be filtered down to the districts, with links to it from Berlin. Tim 11:39, 14 August 2006 (EDT)
I started a little to bring it into the boroughs but I guess that maybe we creat some sites like Berlin nightlife because it is much more helpful than break too many things in the boroughs. Jc8136 05:30, 15 August 2006 (EDT)
  • Support. Kingjeff 22:05, 14 September 2006 (EDT)
  • Contentwise it's there, but this is going to need quite a lot of work to bring it back inline with the Manual of Style... Jpatokal 00:32, 1 February 2007 (EST)
  • I think that it needs quite a lot of work to put the info into good district articles. I'll try look for an alternative -- DanielC 16:37, 2 February 2007 (EST)
  • Oppose, as long as those editorial exhortations to move content to district articles are there. If the job isn't done by the middle of the month, then this needs to get removed from the queue. — Ravikiran 13:12, 5 February 2007 (EST)
  • Do not support. Just too much work remains to be done, as has been true for quite a while. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:13, 6 February 2007 (EST)

Birmingham (England)[edit]

The UK's second city, shopping mecca and apparently more miles of canal than Venice! It's a comprehensive article and there are good maps. Could do with a bit of an MoS finetune and some more photos, but the core material is there. I would suggest that the summer months would be the best time to visit the city (this is due to the obvious issue with the good old English weather in every other season) -- Tim 06:12, 29 October 2006 (EST)

  • Close, but not quite ready yet. More than a "bit" of MoS work needs to be done, lack of photographs is a shortcoming, and if the place "could not be described as a city full of tourist attractions," the "Get out" section should definitely be expanded. Resolve these issues and I'd vote for it; the hard parts (content, maps) are up to standards already, so getting it into shape shouldn't be hard. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 19:33, 24 November 2006 (EST)
    • Fair points. I shall nominate this for CotW and we'll see how that sorts things out. -- Tim 07:26, 26 November 2006 (EST)
Don't support - the 'Sleep' section is too thin for a city of this size, though will support if this can be corrected. WindHorse 01:31, 1 February 2007 (EST)
  • Don't support. I agree that the "Sleep" section needs a lot of improvement. -- DanielC 16:10, 2 February 2007 (EST)

Jerusalem/Old City[edit]

One of the most important square kilometers on Earth! Comprehensive article. Central to Judaism and Christianity, whilst being important in Islam. Great all year round but could fit in well with Christmas time - December in particlar for obvious reasons.Flymeoutofhere 09:36, 9 April 2007 (EDT)

Not yet, it's got a little work. First, I'd like to see more photos (my personal preference is to get a some images of off-the-beaten-path sights), but another problem is that for many listings there's no address or directions. I'd be especially interested in contact info for a lot of the churches and such too. The article also should list a few internet cafes. Regarding December time slot, wouldn't Bethlehem make more sense? I think if this article is chosen to be a DotM to display it in month of Nisan (preferably when Passover, Good Friday, and Easter) would be ideal since travelers could then experience Jewish customs and Christian customs. -- Sapphire • (Talk) • 02:21, 11 April 2007 (EDT)
  • Do not support. I really like the idea of getting Jerusalem into shape for DotM, but the whole city, not just a district, should be the DotM, and it's not there yet. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 10:03, 7 June 2007 (EDT)

Leeds[edit]

Largest city in the wonderful world famous English county of Yorkshire. Has won a host of tourism awards recently including UK Visitor City Of The Year, UK Favourite City, Best City for Clubbing, Most Female friendly city. A host of attractions from museums, countryside, shopping and nightlife. This article is fantasticaly in depth now too.

  • Do not support -- yet. There's a lot of excellent content in this, but it has three serious problems. Several sections are quite out of conformity to the Wikitravel:Manual of style. A tendency toward touting has also crept into some of the text. Third, and hardest to remedy, the lists of attractions are so long and cobbled-together that they're hard to follow. Some way of reorganizing the content needs to be found, so that it doesn't read like a laundry list. All of these objections can be overcome, and I'd gladly change my vote if they were, as the amount of effort that has gone into this article is impressive. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 12:33, 29 December 2006 (EST)
  • Do not support. There is probably too much information, the listings need addresses / phone numbers and the district articles are thin. -- DanielC 16:20, 2 February 2007 (EST)

Lucerne[edit]

It looks like someone tried to nominate this but had syntax problems. I've fixed them so that we can give the article due consideration, but I strenuously oppose using the article as DotM. It's not even close to the standards we require. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:51, 29 August 2007 (EDT)

Montreal[edit]

A very good guide. Best time is summer I presume. -- DanielC 16:39, 5 February 2007 (EST)

There's an ongoing debate on Talk:Montreal about districtifying the city, so it might be best to wait until that's sorted out. Jpatokal 00:02, 6 February 2007 (EST) Agree with Jani. Montreal is a great city that should be DotM at some point, but the district issue really needs to get settled (and has been pending for a long time). In my opinion, districtifying is necessary -- there's altogether too much interesting stuff in Montreal to lump into a single article -- but who will bell the cat? -- Bill-on-the-Hill 15:30, 15 March 2007 (EDT) The districtifying is now in progress, but this is still not ready. Any objections to slushing it again, until the districts are all in shape? -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:02, 27 October 2007 (EDT)

Portland (Oregon)[edit]

Fantastic content on a perennially underestimated city, with "Get out" links to several of the innumerable great-outdoors destinations of the region. The only shortcoming is a shortage of imagery, but that can be remedied. Suggested for August 2007. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:11, 3 December 2006 (EST)

Support, on the condition that some decent images can be dug up. Jpatokal 22:22, 1 February 2007 (EST) Support, although could do with a couple more photographs and telephone numbers for the "eat" items. -- DanielC 17:05, 15 March 2007 (EDT)
  • On thinking about this one, I think it might be best to postpone it until the imagery is in better shape. Furthermore, Albuquerque is looking like an absolute gem for October, and three United States DotMs in a row would be a bit much. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 14:25, 17 April 2007 (EDT)
    • Bump. The image problem still hasn't been fixed. This isn't a bad article, and would be a viable DotM in harder times, but I think it may be better to put Zion into this slot (and Albuquerque in September), leaving this one open for inclusion next year -- if we can dig up some photos. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 09:50, 20 June 2007 (EDT)
Agree. The sole drab image does nothing to enhance the article, so like Bill says, maybe defer until a few good images can be found. That would place Zion in the August slot and Albuquerque in the September one....two US sites in a row. How about Zion for August, Hiroshima for September (they might get a typhoon or two, but they are passed in half a day) and Albuquerque for October? I'll rearrange in that way and then gauge the reaction WindHorse 10:21, 20 June 2007 (EDT) Maybe Albuquerque should be moved into the October slot, since that's when the Balloon Fiesta is happening. But Zion for August? Too hot. Can we push that into September, when it's cooler? PerryPlanet 19:06, 27 June 2007 (EDT)

Quebec[edit]

Québec is unique among tourist destinations. Its French heritage sets the province apart, and it is one of the only areas in North America to have preserved its Francophone culture. Its European feel and its history, culture and warmth have made Québec a favourite tourist destination both nationally and internationally. —The preceding Bonjour Quebec (talkcontribs)

Oppose

The article reeks of racist implication that is of no interest to a vistor. I think most of the article needs to be deleted and one needs to start over and address the interests of a visitor and scrap the information on racist differences, who cares except the residents and it appears they need to grow up. Mention the differences and go on. 2old 15:14, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

  • Do not support -- to put it mildly. I will give the nominator the benefit of the doubt and assume good faith, in which case this is a complete, if well-intentioned, misinterpretation of what a DotM needs to be. This article isn't close. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 15:51, 3 August 2007 (EDT)
  • Do not support - not at all according to our manual of style. Unfortunately User:Bonjour Quebec who is the nominator and did a lot of work on the article does not reply on his/her discussion page. --Flip666 writeme! • 16:16, 3 August 2007 (EDT)
  • Do not support - the Quebec province articles are generally not in good shape, and my impression is that their quality dismayingly has been deteriorating, rather than improving. --Peter Talk 19:16, 3 August 2007 (EDT)
  • Oppose - I would love to see Quebec a DotM, but the article isn't there yet. As a side note, I'm still trying to contact someone at Bonjour Quebec to a)verify the identity of the user using that name and b)discuss how we can collaborate according to our Wikitravel:Goals and non-goals. Maj 23:48, 3 August 2007 (EDT)
    • Would anyone object to slushing this one? The consensus seems overwhelmingly clear... -- Bill-on-the-Hill 23:02, 5 August 2007 (EDT)
  • No objection here. It's not ready to be featured. Gorilla Jones 23:07, 5 August 2007 (EDT)

Sao Gabriel da Cachoeira[edit]

It will be very difficult to find anything more off-the-beaten-path than this place. And it surely makes an amazing trip. User:Guoyifan 05:21 20 February 2007 (EST)

Warsaw[edit]

CotW which has been hugely improved. Very good article. Could do with a better map and more info in a few more districts. Not exactly sure when to put it, maybe summer 2007? Tim 15:45, 14 August 2006 (EDT)

  • Districts are a bit thin, the airport is a nightmare for any traveller but might be good for late summer 2007. Jan 05:42, 15 August 2006 (EDT)
  • Support with a caveat: this is one of those Pattaya-style articles where the content is great but the formatting is a little eccentric to say the least. I fixed up the biggest booboo (Get in stuff in Get out), but this could still use some more work. Jpatokal 22:30, 1 February 2007 (EST)
Luckily, this is one place that I can actually do something about. I hate the fact Pattaya reads like a yellow pages or a paper of random listings and useless services that shithole motels hand out to guests. I'm not going to let that happen this article so I do not support until we make a real attempt at it. I'll do my part. -- Andrew H. (Sapphire) 22:40, 1 February 2007 (EST) Don't support - ditto Sapphire's comments. WindHorse 23:05, 1 February 2007 (EST)
  • Oppose. If you start looking at it closely after the (far too much) travel info, it has far too many districts and then areas labelled as districts that then link to (unique to Warsaw) walking tours. The main district article - Warsaw/Srodmiescie is really just a long list. This is an idiosyncratic work that I don't think we should be promoting. -- DanielC 15:30, 5 February 2007 (EST)
  • Do not support. Really needs MoS-based overhaul. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:14, 6 February 2007 (EST)
  • I don't support this either anymore... It could almost do with going in for another CotW to sort out the MoS problems.--Tim 11:28, 6 February 2007 (EST)
  • Support. I was working hard on this article last September to improve it (independently of this nomination, in fact I've found out about it only now) and I'd be delighted to do everything I can (provided I have the time) to make Warsaw a well-written, informative and helpful article. I see some people have objections to this nomination and it's great, because it means you have read the article and know its weak points. Could you please take a minute or two explaining what exactly needs to be improved, on the article talk page? The reason I'm asking for this is that I'm afraid I don't fully understand what the problem is ("Pattaya-style"?). CandleWithHare 15:58, 2 March 2007 (EST)
Also, please remember the style rules were different at the time most of the article was written and if something isn't explicitly stated in the rules it doesn't mean it's prohibited, so the question that should rather be asked is whether something is reader-friendly or not. CandleWithHare 15:58, 2 March 2007 (EST) Generally, style policies have not changed much, though, there have been some small changes. My attempt to fix and remove a lot of the crap no one would really use was reverted by you, now you'll understand why it needed to be deleted, and I suspect that we'll just end up deleting the same stuff, if not more. The toilet information needs to be deleted. I moved it to the Poland guide, though an explanation of square v. circle could still be used there. No one needs to know all of the major hypermarkets on the Warsaw guide. If it's really important, then we'll put it in the districts, which is what policy requires. Also, we don't need:
  • Ice-skating
  • Bowling
  • Climbing
  • Cycling
  • Golfing
  • Shopping malls
  • Hypermarkets
  • Consumer electronics (Wikitravel isn't a catalog!)
  • Antiques
  • Provisional-now-permanent
Pattaya is bad article because it's the type of thing that a shithole motel gives out to it's guests so they can go and get pizza from Pizza Hut, or whatever and Warsaw (and it's districts) are taking this route. If there is some potentially useful information it's need to be removed to the proper district. A major rewrite is needed too, but that can come last, in my opinion otherwise we'll probably end up where we began. -- Sapphire • (Talk) • 16:16, 2 March 2007 (EST) Ooi! I think almost all of those are useful information, although you should pick a few noteworthy shops/facilities, not list the whole lot. Travellers do go bowling, climbing, cycling, golfing, and shopping, although more probably for antiques than consumer electronics. (At least in Warsaw; the reverse would be true in Hong Kong.) Jpatokal 23:56, 2 March 2007 (EST) I believe it's spelled "Oi". Anyhow, you're right that most of it can be useful, but we need to give an very fine grained overview and shuttle off most of the info to the districts. The Russian Market, as an example does require a mention in the top-level guide, but the nitty gritty details belong in the districts. -- Sapphire • (Talk) • 00:04, 3 March 2007 (EST)

Candle, "Pattaya style" was a reference to how Pattaya had turned into a yellow pages directory, listing absolutely everything that there was possibly to see or do in the place, rather than being a focused and discerning travel guide pointing travelers to just the best and most relevant things. If you're interested, go back into the history on that article and look at it before Sapphire and I started deleting some stuff [or even now, it still needs help ;) ]. Anyway, I would also propose that we delete the 1900's picture and the Emblem of Warsaw pic, which are more appropriate for Wikipedia than here... photos in the articles, I think, should just be ones that aid the traveler by giving a good impression of what to expect when traveling there, anything else just clutters the article... btw, you did a great job on the Warsaw way back when, it's good that you're around again now to help us perfect the article and bring it even more in line with the Manual of Style and the current ideas of good Guide articles - Cacahuate 03:02, 7 March 2007 (EST)

Thanks for the explanation, I get it now. Indeed, I didn't take into account that the article may get too long in the process of improving it :) So, what are we getting rid of first? I agree about the toilet stuff -- personally, I've never understood the peculiarities of the alleged public-toilet problem in the city I live in, but as people keep adding such information, I always thought there was some need for it, with websites such as this one emerging around the world. I also agree about the old photo, which is useless, but it was around before I started meddling with the article, and I was generally unwilling to remove stuff. As for the emblem, I only added it because it occupies the place that would otherwise be empty anyway (at least that's how things show up in my browser). CandleWithHare 12:42, 7 March 2007 (EST)

Windsor (Ontario)[edit]

Fairly complete article. The only problem I really see is a lack of photos, but if I ever get my film developed I can solve that problem. Time format should be MoS'd (I have a hard time reminding myself to do civilian time). Also, I didn't include a whole lot of info for the descriptions of listings, but I'll dfix that in a few days. I thinks some of the strong points are: the "Get in" info, the abundance of nightlife, and the diverse cultural aspects of the city (you have Middle Eastern/Lebanese, Asian, Italian, African neighborhoods all within several minutes of each other).

I'd suggest making this DoTM for summer '07 or early fall. -- Andrew H. (Sapphire) 03:36, 2 December 2006 (EST)

  • I'd support this providing the issues Sapphire mentioned above are addressed. I'd also like to see an understand section, more info in get around and at least a few listings in budget sleep. If that gets done it'll be a nice article. -- Tim 04:47, 2 December 2006 (EST)
  • A problem I see with this is that, while the Windsor article has lots of good stuff, Windsor as a destination is dominated by that city across the river -- and its article still needs serious work despite its "Guide" status. Some discussion of how to handle DotM candidates along national borders, with matching cities across the border, might be appropriate before proceeding with this one. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:30, 3 December 2006 (EST)
OTBP is an option too, but it's not exactly off the path. I suggested summer 07 because looking over I'm not as happy with the article as I thought I was and in a few weeks I should whip this in shape. -- Andrew (Sapphire)
  • Support for OTBP, because iit's not one of the main destinations in Canada (and I've never heard of it!) - DanielC 16:13, 2 February 2007 (EST)
Aren't all destinations in Canada OTBP... by definition? :) But seriously, Detroit/Windsor is Canada's busiest border crossing, and one of the busiest in the world. Just about anyone driving into Canada from the U.S. Midwest goes through Windsor. To say nothing of its popularity among 19/20-year-olds and strip-club patrons throughout Southeast Michigan. -Todd VerBeek 16:14, 5 February 2007 (EST) Since this one is in the gray area between DotM and OtBP, I suggest we consider it a "utility" destination to plug into whichever of the two is more in need of candidates. At the moment the DotM list is actually more sparse than OtBP, so how about we use it for the August DotM (Portland still being short on photos) and look for a different August OtBP? -- Bill-on-the-Hill 14:49, 17 April 2007 (EDT)
  • Support - clean, simple article - summer best for feature? WindHorse 19:34, 2 February 2007 (EST)
  • The current blurb does a really bad job of selling the destination (automobile industry? near Detroit?), and the article doesn't have anything better. Could somebody who knows the place better come up with something nice/interesting? Jpatokal 01:35, 17 June 2007 (EDT)
I took a stab at reorganizing the blurb based on available facts. However, it is still not very appealing. I reiterate Jpatokal's appeal for someone familiar with the city to add fresh and interesting info. WindHorse 02:11, 17 June 2007 (EDT)
  • Potentially don't support – So maybe I'm chiming in a little late in the game here, but how did this make it so far in the first place? I appreciate that the article covers the destination so well, but it's still sounding like a thoroughly uninteresting place, and I'm not convinced that it's one of the 2 articles that should represent the site for an entire month. A park along the river with views of Detroit and drunk-ass 19-20 year old Americans with but-her-face strippers in their laps are the main highlights? No thanks. When I think of OTBP it conjures up images of quaint little cities or far off villages just waiting to be explored and uncovered – not busy border crossing towns. Sorry to throw that out there so last minute, but are there any alternatives? – cacahuate talk 02:32, 17 June 2007 (EDT)
Yeah, it is not a great destination, but there is no substitute in the nomination list at present. I'll enter Jakar in Bhutan for consideration as a possible alternative as this a summer only destination. WindHorse 02:43, 17 June 2007 (EDT) Sado Island has been nominated as an alternative destination to Windsor. See below. WindHorse 04:53, 17 June 2007 (EDT)

Space[edit]

Just throwin' it out there... can't get more OTBP than that... and the article's pretty comprehensive, considering the limited options... and I'm in love with the new opening picture... OR... should this wait a couple/few years until there's a little larger # of people going up each year? – cacahuate talk 01:08, 11 April 2007 (EDT)

At first I thought this was a little ridiculous, but I'm rather pleasantly surprised by the article. I mean there's off-the-beaten-path, then there's absurd. Some of the options listed in the guide are surprisingly cheap and with a little savings someone like me – trying to get into college and working a job at a restaurant – could actually participate in. If I hadn't actually read the article I'd be ignorant about those options. However, the thing that sold me is that the understand section is very, very eloquent, which we often lack in our guides. I think this would be the perfect DotM/OtBP candidate, especially as it highlight and exemplifies some of our goals and philosophies, which can never be expressed by our other guides. Support -- Sapphire • (Talk) • 05:08, 11 April 2007 (EDT) Support. Nowhere is cooler than the space! Guoyifan 12 April (EDT)
  • Actually Space can be very hot as well. :) Support. No hurry to feature it; it's not going anywhere. - Todd VerBeek 12:24, 12 April 2007 (EDT)
  • Do not support -- yet. Cute idea, and well-done article, but too many offerings in the article aren't presently available no matter how much money you have. When Virgin Galactic, etc., actually start offering trips rather than just promising them in the future, I'll reconsider. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 20:52, 12 April 2007 (EDT)
Yeah, good point Bill. I suppose it would also suck to feature it now, and then when things are really rockin' up there not want to feature it again. Waiting might be good. – cacahuate talk 23:08, 12 April 2007 (EDT) So let's provisionally slot it for June 2015 - 2020, in case NASA starts taking people to the moon. I say June because that seems to be when the weather permits shuttle launches. -- Sapphire • (Talk) • 23:13, 12 April 2007 (EDT) Don't plan on seeing any Shuttle launches in 2015; those birds will be 23-31 years old by then, and fit for museum display only. - Todd VerBeek 09:39, 13 April 2007 (EDT) Well, supposedly they don't want to send shuttles to the moon, but something closer to the Apollo modules. Plus, the current birds are going to retire in 2010, then we can all go to Dayton and see them up close and personal. -- Sapphire • (Talk) • I though the Toyota Prius was being modified for moon launches, no? – cacahuate talk 11:15, 13 April 2007 (EDT)

Yangon[edit]

"Known for its colonial architecture, which although decaying, remains an almost unique example of a 19th-century British colonial capital." A good number of sights, hotels and eateries listed. An interesting guide that has info about history, as well as stuff about staying safe/healthy. November to January is a good time to visit, so maybe a candidate for the empty December or January slots. -- Tim (writeme!) 15:50, 17 August 2007 (EDT)

  • Do not support. Yes, it's an interesting article, but according to Wikipedia, this city has a population of nearly 5 million, and the coverage is awfully sparse for a city that size. (Incidentally, I'd also consider it more DotM material than OtBP for the same reason; it certainly isn't off the "Asian" beaten path.) I'd be willing to consider changing my vote if someone could make a convincing case that the coverage really is comprehensive despite the size of the city, but to actually get me to change it would also require a bunch of MoS work -- hours and locations for attractions, restaurants, etc. It's all doable, though. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 19:15, 18 September 2007 (EDT)
  • Do not support, partly due to MoS concerns, partly given the recent unpleasantness. Jpatokal 06:37, 15 October 2007 (EDT)
  • Do not support. Travel to Burma is an inherently political act and, by highlighting Yangon anywhere, wikitravel will take a side in the 'go nogo' battle. Best to let the reader decide. Also agree with Bill-on-the-Hill's comments about the sparseness of the page (the see section is pathetic, nothing confirms to the MOS, etc.) and am trying to fix some of that but, even if the article were a star, I would be against featuring it.--Wandering 14:38, 26 October 2007 (EDT)
    • Comment: I don't think politics in themselves are a valid reason to object to a destination, or are we going to rule out ever having a DotM in, say, Israel or Iran? Actively dangerous destinations should of course be avoided, but I think things have quieted down enough now that I withdraw my objection on this ground. Jpatokal 22:21, 26 October 2007 (EDT)
      • Agree about the politics; if the "unpleasantness" creates problems for the traveler, that's a consideration, but political statements aren't a reason to push or reject a destination. My other reasons for opposing this nomination remain, however. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 12:48, 30 October 2007 (EDT)
    • The point is that pushing Yangon as a destination is itself a political statement. I don't think the situation is the same as in Israel (a democratic state albeit with some issues) or Iran (also a kind of democracy albeit with a bit more than some issues!). Having a good guide for Yangon is one thing but featuring it as a destination feels, IMHO, a bit dirty. Anyway, I'll plug away on the Yangon page regardless.--Wandering 13:47, 30 October 2007 (EDT)
I kinda agree with Wandering - whether or not to go to Myanmar has been turned into a rather large moral question, and us putting it on the front page looks like we're saying yes. I wouldn't fight hard not to feature a Myanmar destination, but I would like everyone to understand that, if we do, it is definitely making a political statement, intentional or not – cacahuate talk 14:53, 30 October 2007 (EDT)

2006[edit]

Bad Reichenhall[edit]

  • Bad Reichenhall would be good for the summer.Kingjeff 13:59, 11 Feb 2006 (EST)
    • Do not support. No pictures, no map, no explanations or contact info for the very long laundry lists. Whoever called this a "Guide" was being awfully generous. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 10:13, 15 Feb 2006 (EST)
    • In your opinion, what status should it have? Kingjeff 17:34, 15 Feb 2006 (EST)
      • Usable, for reasons I give on your talk page. Definitely at the upper end of Usable, but more is needed before this qualifies as a DotM. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 19:47, 17 Feb 2006 (EST)

Belfast[edit]

    • Self-nominated by Professorbiscuit 08:22, 11 Oct 2004 (EDT).
    • This is really nice. I think I'd like to see a little more content, or maybe it's not as big a city as I think? Is there any month that would be specially good? I don't know if November is a great time to visit, or is summer better?
    • The "Do" section is a bit light, and some items from "See" should probably be moved there. Once that gets done this seems like a great article. -- Ryan 03:37, 1 Aug 2005 (EDT)
      • Done.Tim 11:27, 14 August 2006 (EDT)
    • Needs to be rated. kingjeff 00:30, 2 Jan 2006 (EST)
      • Done.Tim 11:27, 14 August 2006 (EDT)

Adding back into Detination of the Month Tim 11:27, 14 August 2006 (EDT)

Cape Town[edit]

Added to the slush pile because this was nominated despite having been previously featured in 2005, and the nomination criteria specifically states that a destination should not be featured twice:

Cape Town is a very interesting city that is perfect to visit from November until March (summer) and therefore dits very good for December. The article is ok and it's an African destinations that everybody wants to go too! Therefore I would like to nominate it for december. Jan08:29, 20 June 2006

  • Already featured back in September 2005. — Ravikiran 08:53, 20 June 2006 (EDT)
  • Agreed, we really can't do this one again (at least not until everywhere else in the world has been featured once...). -- Bill-on-the-Hill 09:23, 20 June 2006 (EDT)

Copenhagen[edit]

Well-constructed article on an important city, with good balance between main article and districts. (Some of the district articles could use some work, but there's time, and the totality of the articles is still excellent.) Plus, this photo just absolutely demands to get put on the Main Page! -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:23, 29 June 2006 (EDT)

  • The article needs some work. The districts are ok but the main Copenhagen pages lacks big chunks (Sleep, Drink, Cope, Learn). It should be better before a Cotw to get the formatting and content things done.-- Jan 12:13, 4 July 2006 (EDT)

Flores (Guatemala)[edit]

A very good guide article, also includes a couple of maps. -- DanielC 08:42, 3 May 2006 (EDT)

  • I don't think it's quite ready yet. There should be some work to reconcile "Do" and "Get out" -- the latter is content-free at the moment apart from a somewhat garish map, while the former has lots of stuff that seems to be rather remote from the city. Shouldn't be too hard to fix that, though, and it's otherwise a nice article. One thing: is it DotM or OTBP? -- Bill-on-the-Hill 09:44, 3 May 2006 (EDT)
  • The "garishness" of the Get Out map can be fixed easily enough with a less saturated background color; otherwise I kinda like it. Flores does seem a bit OTBP to me, being neither large, famous, nor in a heavily-visited region. And since one of its main attractions is nearby Tikal, I'd like to see that built up (the article, that is, not the site) before featuring Flores.- Todd VerBeek 10:40, 3 May 2006 (EDT)
I've moved most of the "See" items to "Get out", but I tend to agree with Todd that it is probably worth waiting on this article until the Tikal one is improved. I also thought that it may be better as a OTBP destination, but thought that as the base for the main site in Guatamala, it was difficult to say that it wasn't mainstream. -- DanielC 16:03, 4 May 2006 (EDT)

Graz[edit]

  • Graz is good for January because of the ski resorts. Kingjeff
    • Several of the listings need to be updated according to the Manual of style. The info in the article looks good though. -- Ryan 03:06, 26 Dec 2005 (EST)
    • Needs article status and more info as mentioned above. Kingjeff 00:44, 2 Jan 2006 (EST)

Kruger National Park[edit]

Good article that will need a bit of MoSing, as some info is in the wrong sections. The Understand needs to be split up into climate/fauna etc. Having said this, the info is there and a CotW would sort it out. Possible candidate for Feb 07? It is also an African article, and we haven't had an African DotM since September 05. Finally, having this as DotM might also draw a few editors down to South African articles so we can get some more info into them! -- Tim 06:55, 15 August 2006 (EDT)

  • Whoa! This still needs quite a bit of work -- sections are unpopulated, key contact info is missing (and may be hard to get), and so on. Also, there needs to be discussion as to whether it's DotM or OTBP. I'm in favor of getting this into usable shape, for all the reasons you cite above, but it first needs to be improved to where it's ready, then scheduled into the appropriate slot (more likely OTBP than DotM, IMHO). -- Bill-on-the-Hill 08:48, 15 August 2006 (EDT)
  • Agree with Bill contentwise, but I do think this (just) qualifies for DOTM: it's probably Africa's best-known and busiest national park (a quick Googling says over 500,000 visitors yearly), although the huge size does compensate to some extent. Jpatokal 08:59, 15 August 2006 (EDT)
    • Okay. It's on the list of things to do! Tim 12:06, 15 August 2006 (EDT)
    • Since it was posed as a CotW with the statement that it was nominated for Feb 07, I've made it so, but I'm not convinced it's going to get there from a quality perspective. We should keep an eye on it once the CotW editing is done, to be sure that it really is good enough. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 21:30, 14 September 2006 (EDT)
      • Not as many people ended up contributing to this when it was COTW as I had hoped, and I will have nowhere near enough time to make this DotM standard, so I think it should be removed from the nominations list until it gets alot more material. It will make a fantastic article though because it is a fantastic place! Tim 13:20, 25 October 2006 (EDT)
        • OK, it's getting slushed, reluctantly. It would be really nice if someone would make the effort to get it up to standard (and thanks for your tries, Tim) -- we could definitely use a DotM like this. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 10:54, 24 November 2006 (EST)

Montreal[edit]

Has a map, very thorough article and good city to visit. Kingjeff 16:56, 3 March 2006 (EST)

  • Not bad, but Montreal is too big a city to fit smoothly into a single article. Should be broken into districts and much content moved to same, at which time it should be revisited, as it is indeed a cool place well worthy of being a DotM. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 16:50, 4 March 2006 (EST)
  • There seems to be no current advocacy for this one, nor any move to address the issues. Can it be slushed? -- Bill-on-the-Hill 21:44, 17 May 2006 (EDT)

I don't agree that Montreal needs to be split into districts, as the districts are not familiar to many travellers. Better to keep all of the content on Montreal, this is great content, for all to discover.

Munich[edit]

Most people would associate Munich with September, because of Oktoberfest, but I think it would be great for the month of June/July.

  • Nominated by Sapphire 13:42, 18 Apr 2005 (EDT)
  • Nomination withdrawn until August is debated, so I have time to put in districts. Sapphire 16:52, 19 Apr 2005 (EDT)
  • I would suggest tightening up the formatting a little better (according to the wikitravel guidelines) and improving the grammar. --User:kenliu
  • Support for March.Kingjeff 21:06, 31 Jan 2006 (EST)
  • Would August be unreasonable? Gives enough time to make plans for Oktoberfest. Yes, the formatting and grammar could use some work, but there's plenty of time for that and the content is in good shape already. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 08:59, 1 Feb 2006 (EST)
  • I would like to get 1 location in before FIFA World Cup. Kingjeff 23:26, 2 Feb 2006 (EST)
  • Is there anyway we can bump Munich up to May? Kingjeff 22:10, 7 Feb 2006 (EST)
    • Districting is not complete, there is still some duplication and most of the districts don't follow the template. Even the main page is a bit odd. Jpatokal 02:23, 8 Feb 2006 (EST)
    • Does all the districts really need to be there? Kingjeff 19:42, 8 Feb 2006 (EST)
    • They don't all need to be filled up, but they should at least be formatted correctly, and all sights/destinations should be in the right place. Jpatokal 01:29, 9 Feb 2006 (EST)
  • Considering how great this would be for Sep/Oct, I think it should probably wait. --Evan 10:28, 27 February 2006 (EST)
  • Is there any German city we can nominate and have a ligitimate chance of gettin the DOTM before June? Kingjeff 21:21, 27 February 2006 (EST)
    • Berlin is already nominated: contentwise it's there, it just needs a lot of grunt work to district properly... so if you want to see it as DOTM, get to work =) Jpatokal 23:52, 27 February 2006 (EST)
  • Districting needs work. Few attractions have locations or phone numbers listed -- just websites. Too little Manual-of-style. Looks like a slush pile entry to me -- and then renominate when someone thinks it's ready rather than nominating an article that would we all wish was ready. -- Colin 18:46, 20 March 2006 (EST)
  • Anyone object to placing Munich in the slush pile? I doubt few people will have a signifcant problem with MoS, with the exception being the clubs and discos. The districts are coming together, but Thalkirchen sucks. Haidhausen and Olympic area could be better. Andrew Haggard (Sapphire) 17:12, 18 May 2006 (EDT)

Newcastle (New South Wales)[edit]

Looks like a fairly good article. Could be a little more MoSie and a few more sleep listings. Plus, it's summer there in November, December 2006. Andrew Haggard (Sapphire) 00:01, 20 May 2006 (EDT)

  • I don't think it's quite there yet. "See" and "Understand" both need significant work, and significant info is missing on some of the entries. Every reason to believe it could be put into DotM shape by (austral) summer, though. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 23:40, 31 May 2006 (EDT)

Rotorua[edit]

The most visted tourist destitnation in New Zealand. The Weather is generally good. But the summer monthes are preferable. Rotorua is home to the world famous geysers and thermal mud pools, it also the home to zorbing. basically Rotorua is a great place if you want extreme sports OR if you are more interested in relaxing it has many great spas with the mineral from the thermal pools.

  • Please read #Nominate above. Destination of the month is a way to feature the best Wikitravel articles, and this does not meet that criteria. -- Ryan 19:28, 18 October 2006 (EDT)
  • Oppose. Article is not up to snuff for DotM: for example, the Sleep section has only one hotel.
  • Oppose, but a question: just how big and developed is the place? If it's OTBP-size, the article is really not that far from ready. As far as I can tell, the entire Rotorua district has a population of only 50,000 or so, which means that it (1) may be appropriate for OTBP and (2) might not have to have that much information added to become comprehensive. Still will need lots of MoS work, though. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:41, 28 October 2006 (EDT)
    • This one doesn't seem to be getting legs. Any objections to slush-piling it? -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:24, 3 December 2006 (EST)

Salzburg[edit]

  • Salzburg (city)- Salzburg would be good for May 2008 since Austria is a co-host for Euro 2008.
    • Listings need to be MoS'd. The Eat, Drink and Sleep listings also need more details (addresses, prices etc). Jpatokal 23:55, 1 Jan 2006 (EST)
    • Needs understand section plus some additional info mentioned above. Kingjeff 00:39, 2 Jan 2006 (EST)

Stockholm[edit]

Guide article, I've added lots of images and some more information. / Adestro

  • It's close, but a go/no-go decision should be made as to the use of districts. There is a big long section that lays the districts out as sub-articles, but no district articles exist yet, let alone have any content. Either use 'em or purge 'em. Some copyediting would also be useful, but nothing major. Your added photos are certainly nice. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:53, 25 February 2006 (EST)
    • Yeah, I agree. I added that section just before posting this nomination. Perhaps we should wait until the districts have been done, I don't live in Stockholm so I'm unable to contribute to them. /Adestro 15:26, 26 February 2006 (EST)

Torino[edit]

  • Torino for February 2006. Torino is hosting the 2006 Winter Olympic Games and it would be an excellent DotM for Feb. Our coverage of Torino right now is so-so but I bet if we put our minds to it we could really get it cooking. --Evan 00:09, 17 Dec 2005 (EST)
    • Good choice. But more info is needed before it'll get picked. Kingjeff
    • Support. I realize I've already supported Hangzhou, but the Winter Olympics are just too good a tie-in. If we can pull the article together, would others supprot Torino for Feb? I'll put together a list of what needs to get done. Majnoona 14:45, 29 Jan 2006 (EST)
    • Do not support. This is a perfect example of why a longer lead time is desirable for DotM. There is too much left to do on the article on the spur of the moment, and in any event, it's far too late to be able to use this page for travel for the Olympics, since lodging in particular will be nearly impossible to find at this late date. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 15:09, 29 Jan 2006 (EST)
    • Against. I agree completely with Bill, it's way too late for Torino. I wouldn't mind nudging it onto the Main Page though... but in the meantime, time to start polishing up Vancouver for 2010? Jpatokal 07:14, 31 Jan 2006 (EST)
      • Agree about the Main Page, and we do have the 2008 Olympics coming before Vancouver... -- Bill-on-the-Hill 09:18, 31 Jan 2006 (EST)
    • It would be nice to in some way feature Torino during the Olympics, but I agree that it's too late to make it DOTM. -- Ryan 21:13, 31 Jan 2006 (EST)

Waitomo Caves (New Zealand)[edit]

Waitomo Caves is just a 2 hour drive from Auckland. It is home to the famous Waitomo Caves, Glowworms,There are many places to view the glowworms including some where you just take a boat road, to others with a 4 hour walk. Apart from the glowworm there is alot to do in the area including a free Angoran rabbit shearing show. —The preceding 220.245.179.131 (talk • contribs) 18 Oct 2006

  • Please read #Nominate above, as well as Wikitravel:What is an article?. Destination of the month is a way to feature the best Wikitravel articles, and this does not meet that criteria. -- Ryan 19:28, 18 October 2006 (EDT)

2005[edit]

Stuttgart[edit]

  • Stuttgart- is a beutiful city and will be hosting the World Cup in 2006. So, May would be a good time to put it up as Destination of the Month.
    • Need pictures, formatting into the standard template and more places to Sleep. Jpatokal 23:20, 11 Dec 2005 (EST)
      • Are we basing cities on the actual city or based on what wikitravel has? I understand not nominating a city that has little or no information, but you can only go so far with that.
        • The criteria for choosing a DotM are at the top of this page. --Evan 10:56, 12 Dec 2005 (EST)

Walnut Creek[edit]

  • Walnut Creek. Lacks a picture, but otherwise a very complete and readable article. --Evan 13:42, 27 Jun 2005 (EDT)
    • While I like this article, I don't think Walnut Creek is a destination per se, especially if Frankfurt was already put into the slush pile as a good article but a less than ideal destination. Walnut Creek might be better used as an example of how to write an interesting article, rather than a destination of the month. -- Ryan 03:37, 1 Aug 2005 (EDT)

Ipoh[edit]

  • Ipoh. Good chinese food paradise.
    • Nominated by Maldini8289 10:47, 14 April 2005 (EST)
    • No Sleep listings, and needs to be checked carefully because some content is copyvio'd from Wikipedia... Jpatokal 01:48, 15 Apr 2005 (EDT)
    • The sleep listings are done, the content are not copyvio'd from Wikipedia as it's mainly all edited by me, a local resident. Maldini8289 1:18, 19 May 2005 (EST)
    • The formatting does not follow the MoS (although I just inserted the standard headings). In particular, the Eat/Drink/Buy listings should cover [i]places[/i] to eat/drink/buy, not things. Of course an intro paragraph for local specialities is great, but the focus of the listing should be on restaurants/bars/shops.
    • In my honest opinion, the Eat/Drink/Buy listings can't just cover on particular places or restaurants/bars/shops because Ipoh's variety of great food are at many places around the city. Hope that the current listing won't be changed so that many travellers won't miss out these food when they come to Ipoh. Thanks a lot, Jpatokal, for helping to edit. Maldini8289 13:20, 23 May 2005 (EST)
      • We could say that about most destinations. The idea here is yes, to give travellers some idea of what sort of foods they might find, and point out a couple of local specialties which are not to be missed. The idea of the listings though is provide names and addresses, contact information, opening hours, and a short review of actual places where they can enjoy a nice meal. DOM is a showcase for our best articles. Ipoh seems like a lovely place to visit, but the article just isn't one of our best (yet). We really must have some listings for individual places. Some more images would be nice too. -- Mark 03:46, 23 May 2005 (EDT)

Frankfurt[edit]

  • Frankfurt
    • nominated by Mark 04:41, 30 Aug 2004 (EDT)
      • The museums listings need to be completed at the very least. -- Nils
      • Good article, but a terribly boring city to visit =) Jpatokal 05:27, 30 Aug 2004 (EDT)
        • I tend to agree, but didn't want to say it ;-) I guess it depends on what you like. And nobody (yet) said DoM's have to be "exciting". ;-) -- Nils
          • Ok, let me say it. DoM candidates should be at least interesting, if not exciting. The purpose (I assume) of the DOM is to show off what we have, and tempt new visitors to dig further; showcasing (say) a derelict coal-mining town in the ex-Soviet rust belt is hardly likely to do that. Having said that, my 12 hour experience of Frankfurt doesn't suggest that it is *that* uninteresting. -- Chris j wood 11:36, 1 Sep 2004 (EDT)

Okavango Delta[edit]

  • Okavango Delta
    • One of the most famous and beautiful places on earth and still no information in wikitravel... Nominated by Fluglotse2000
      • Uh, this one might fit better on Wikitravel:Articles needing attention, "Destination of the Month" is kinda for showing off the finished (as much as anything is finished on a wiki) guides we're proud of-- usually with some sort of seasonal tie-in. They should really be as complete as possible and Okavango, beautiful as it may be, has a ways to go ;-) Majnoona 11:18, 6 Apr 2005 (EDT)

South Africa[edit]

United States[edit]

  • United States
    • Nominated by Rspga49 19:30 (EST) April 4, 2005
    • That's kinda a vague destination (because it encompasses too many sub-topics) and not a really exciting article. Also, the vast majority of the subregions are stubs. How about choosing a specific and interesting destination within the US, working on its article until it is complete, informative, and interesting, and then nominating that. A DoM article need not be about a famous or important place. It should instead be an interesting destination with a Really Great Article written about it. -- Colin 19:43, 4 Apr 2005 (EDT)
    • I agree with Colin. Too broad and hard to tie to a season or month. Majnoona 11:33, 5 Apr 2005 (EDT)

2004[edit]

London[edit]

  • London
    • Nominated by Rspga49 16:09 October 17, 2004 (EDT)
    • A great article I think everyone would agree-- when's a good month? Majnoona 01:45, 30 Oct 2004 (EDT)
    • Currently, London sufferes from linkitis — the use of web links instead of trivial stuff like descriptions, directions, addresses and phone numbers. Needs cleanup first. -- Colin 21:33, 10 Mar 2005 (EST)

San Francisco[edit]

  • San Francisco
    • Nominated by Chip 10:14, 18 Jul 2004 (EDT)
    • Support with two caveats: the Districts section should give brief summaries of what to expect, and the picture needs a little work (poorly scanned?) Jpatokal 11:15, 18 Jul 2004 (EDT)
    • I think San Francisco needs some cleanup work. --Evan 20:06, 18 Jul 2004 (EDT)

Uluru-Kata Tjuta National Park[edit]

  • Uluru-Kata Tjuta National Park (Australia)
    • Having tried in vain to find a good African article, how about this one from Australia. It has a couple of good pictures, and good text. And I can vouch from personal experience that it is a fascinating place if you have never seen the 'Red Center' before -- Chris j wood 21:46, 5 Sep 2004 (EDT)
    • Not bad contentwise, but needs a little cleanup. Some listings are also quite stubby (just the name with no content). Jpatokal 01:24, 6 Sep 2004 (EDT)
      • Agreed, too unfinnished. -- Nils
    • I'm slowly working on this one (I don't think it's ready yet), so people may want to check back over the next month or two. It's probably not a good southern summer destination anyway: humid and rainy. -- Hypatia 22:36, 28 Nov 2004 (EST)

Atlanta[edit]

  • Atlanta
    • Nominated by Rspga49 18:00 October 1, 2004 (EDT)
    • There's a lot missing from Atlanta before it really can be considered. E.g. there is no Sleep, Drink, Stay Safe, Picture,.... Keep up the good work and try to get it into shape before nominating it. Have a look at the current destination of the month or previous destinations to get an idea of what we're looking for. -- Colin 18:23, 1 Oct 2004 (EDT)

Valdosta[edit]

  • Valdosta
    • Nominated by Rspga49 17:50 October 1, 2004 (EDT)
    • Valdosta appears to be composed of two kinds of things that need work: 1) empty sections and 2) sections whose listings are not formatted in the Manual of Style manner and also one section (Get out) which is not really a list of interesting places you might go to get out of town (it's just a list of nearby cities).Keep up the good work and try to get it into shape before nominating it. Have a look at the current destination of the month or previous destinations to get an idea of what we're looking for. -- Colin 18:23, 1 Oct 2004 (EDT)

Upgraded articles[edit]

This section is for articles that were formerly slushpiled, but have been promoted back to DotM-candidate status as the objections were addressed. Looking at some of these articles, in particular their histories, might give you some ideas about getting things on the current slushpile into usable condition. Note: If you add items to this list, please try to keep them in alphabetical, rather than chronological, order, for ease in sorting through the material.

Berlin[edit]

  • Berlin- Berlin would be good for May 2006 since FIFA World Cup Germany will be there. kingjeff
    • I support Berlin for February 2006. Kingjeff 23:45, 1 Jan 2006 (EST)
    • Berlin's division into districts is badly incomplete, with tons of duplication and most info still listed only on the main page. Jpatokal 23:55, 1 Jan 2006 (EST)
    • It's listed on the main page. It's a very thorough article. I don't think it's as bad as you think it is. It's a good article and a good city to visit. I think any traveller can pretty much fill there vacation to Berlin with this information. Kingjeff 00:21, 2 Jan 2006 (EST)
    • Do not support. This article is badly in need of breaking into districts, precisely as Jpatokal says. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 22:56, 13 Jan 2006 (EST)
    • Do not support. But I think as soon as the district issue is taken care of it should be revisited. Majnoona 11:53, 15 Feb 2006 (EST)
  • Re-slushed following 2007 discussion; see above. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 09:57, 9 April 2007 (EDT)

Budapest[edit]

  • Attractive city with lots to see. The articles are good now and the pictures are really good too. -- DanielC 16:59, 9 Jun 2005 (EDT)
    • I've been to Budapest in January, and it's not much fun then (except maybe ice-skating and mulled wine at Varosliget). I would be all in favor of a springtime nomination though. Jpatokal 03:40, 17 Dec 2005 (EST)
    • 2 or 3 sections needs to be done. kingjeff 00:35, 2 Jan 2006 (EST)

La Paz[edit]

  • La Paz - South American (see above). Quite a small article, but information in each of the categories. DanielC 08:19, 4 Nov 2005 (EST)
    • Indeed, a little short but otherwise OK. Not sure we need South America now though, as we just had the Falklands... Jpatokal 02:31, 16 Nov 2005 (EST)
    • Not eligible due to article status. kingjeff 00:35, 2 Jan 2006 (EST)
    • The above issues appear to have been addressed, and it's been re-added as a DotM candidate. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:08, 24 November 2006 (EST)

Route 66[edit]

  • A historic highway in the United States, Route 66 has been a classic itinerary for years, and user Rt66lt has been making huge strides with this article. Probably best if featured between April and October when there isn't snow anywhere along the route.
    • Nominated by Ryan 14:24, 10 Sep 2005 (EDT)
    • Support contentwise, but this needs better pictures — one good enough to showcase on the front page, and others to liven up the text. Some maps would also come in very handy. Jpatokal 16:16, 10 Sep 2005 (EDT)
    • Maps and pictures now in place (I'd use the "Cadillac Ranch" photo to illustrate the article), so it's back on the nominee list. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 11:22, 24 November 2006 (EST)

Swansea[edit]

  • Swansea for October 2005 as this is an especially exciting month to visit Wales' City by the Sea: The US$60 million National Waterfront Museum opens its doors on October 17 [14]. Also, the city will host the annual Swansea Festival of Music and the Arts from September 30 to October 22 (the second largest festival of its kind in the UK) [15], from October 1 to 9 the Swansea Fringe will bring festivity and entertainment to the streets of city after a twenty year absence, and finally The Dylan Thomas Centre in the city will reverberate to the sound of Thomas' poetry and prose during the annual Dylan Thomas festival, which runs from October 27 to November 9.
    • Support. Could use a couple more pictures, and "Media" isn't a standard header, but otherwise very nice. DOTM for October sounds reasonable unless Munich gets re-nominated. -- Ryan 03:37, 1 Aug 2005 (EDT)
    • Oppose, half-heartedly. The solitary picture just isn't good enough, and we just had Winchester in July, so it's a bit early for the UK to come again. The formatting is also a bit off in many parts. Jpatokal 00:22, 20 Sep 2005 (EDT)
  • These objections seem to have been addressed; it's now not only back in the Candidates list, but apparently heading for DotM in July 07. -- Bill-on-the-Hill 17:06, 14 June 2007 (EDT)

Cape Town[edit]

Copenhagen[edit]

San Francisco[edit]